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Updated on Tuesday, July 29 at 08:07 PM EST
The most recently received Mail is at the top.


Veery,©David Sibley

29 Jul Hilton Pond 07/01/14 (Midsummer Harvest) ["Bill Hilton Jr. (RESEARCH)" ]
28 Jul RFI: Apps for UK birding [donald lewis ]
28 Jul ABA event in Colorado [Rick Wright ]
27 Jul 30 Years With Hummingbirds ["Bill Hilton Jr. (RESEARCH)" ]
27 Jul Cuvier's kinglet [Rick Wright ]
26 Jul BirdNote, last week & the week of July 27, 2014 [Ellen Blackstone ]
26 Jul truly concerning bird news! [Devorah the Ornithologist ]
24 Jul the Rathbone warbler [Rick Wright ]
24 Jul Rathbone Warbler [Paul Rakow ]
24 Jul The owl who liked sitting on caesar [Devorah the Ornithologist ]
23 Jul Re: Carbonated Warbler [Jerry Friedman ]
23 Jul carbonated warbler [Rick Wright ]
22 Jul Carbonated Warbler [Al Schirmacher ]
22 Jul Cormorant In Japan [Eric Jeffrey ]
21 Jul Birding Community E-bulletin - July 2014 [Barbara Volkle and Steve Moore ]
21 Jul Birding Community E-bulletin - June 2014 [Barbara Volkle and Steve Moore ]
19 Jul Re: Birders should return to observation instead of... [Alvaro Jaramillo ]
19 Jul BirdNote, last week & the week of July 20, 2014 [Ellen Blackstone ]
18 Jul Re: BIRDCHAT Digest - 16 Jul 2014 to 17 Jul 2014 (#2014-152) []
17 Jul Re: yellow-breasted chat ["Spector, David (Biology)" ]
17 Jul Re: yellow-breasted chat [Alvaro Jaramillo ]
17 Jul The Swallows are Getting Ready to Leave [Joyanne Hamilton ]
16 Jul Re: BIRDCHAT Digest - 14 Jul 2014 to 15 Jul 2014 (#2014-150) []
16 Jul Re: Birders should return to observation instead of... [marys1000 ]
16 Jul Re: Birders should return to observation instead of... [Jerry Friedman ]
16 Jul Re: Birders should return to observation instead of... ["Barry K. MacKay" ]
16 Jul Re: Birders should return to observation instead of... [Richard Carlson ]
16 Jul Re: Birders should return to observation instead of... [Chuck & Lillian ]
16 Jul Re: Birders should return to observation instead of... ["Tangren, Gerald Vernon" ]
16 Jul Re: Birders should return to observation instead of... [William Leigh ]
15 Jul Re: Birders should return to observation instead of... [Chuck & Lillian ]
15 Jul Re: [EXTERNAL] [BIRDCHAT] Fish Crow in Door Co. WI? ["Gorton, Gregg" ]
15 Jul Fish Crow in Door Co. WI? [Rick King ]
14 Jul 6 day 3000 mile flight - Semipal Sandpiper []
14 Jul Post article about birding [Rick Wright ]
14 Jul Birders should return to observation instead of ‘c ollecting’ (article) ["B.G. Sloan" ]
12 Jul Re: yellow-breasted chat [Michael Wiegand ]
12 Jul Re: yellow-breasted chat [Richard Carlson ]
12 Jul BirdNote, last week & the week of July 13, 2014 [Ellen Blackstone ]
11 Jul yellow-breasted chat [Rick Wright ]
10 Jul Interesting Blue Jay food choice ["B.G. Sloan" ]
10 Jul Re: [EXTERNAL] [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn ["Gorton, Gregg" ]
10 Jul William W.H. Gunn [Helen Snyder ]
10 Jul Re: William W.H. Gunn []
9 Jul Re: Sooty Shearwaters outperform the whales... [Richard Carlson ]
9 Jul a book you may want to read [Devorah the Ornithologist ]
9 Jul Sooty Shearwaters outperform the whales... ["Barry K. MacKay" ]
9 Jul Re: William W.H. Gunn []
9 Jul Re: William W.H. Gunn [Peter Wilkinson ]
9 Jul Re: Variable skill ["Tangren, Gerald Vernon" ]
9 Jul Re: William W.H. Gunn ["Barry K. MacKay" ]
9 Jul Variable skill [Al Schirmacher ]
8 Jul Re: William W.H. Gunn [Alvaro Jaramillo ]
8 Jul Re: William W.H. Gunn [Alvaro Jaramillo ]
8 Jul Re: William W.H. Gunn []
8 Jul Re: William W.H. Gunn ["Barry K. MacKay" ]
8 Jul Re: William W.H. Gunn []
8 Jul Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn ["Gorton, Gregg" ]
8 Jul Re: William W.H. Gunn ["Barry K. MacKay" ]
8 Jul Re: William W.H. Gunn [Alan Wormington ]
8 Jul Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch [Alvaro Jaramillo ]
8 Jul Re: Neltje Blanchan's purple finch []
8 Jul field guides and sources [Rick Wright ]
8 Jul Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch [Dick Cannings ]
8 Jul Re: Neltje Blanchan's purple finch ["Gorton, Gregg" ]
8 Jul Re: Neltje Blanchan's purple finch ["Spector, David (Biology)" ]
8 Jul Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch ["Gorton, Gregg" ]
8 Jul Re: Neltje Blanchan's purple finch []
5 Jul BirdNote, last week & the week of July 6, 2014 [Ellen Blackstone ]
5 Jul Neltje Blanchan's purple finch [Rick Wright ]
4 Jul Hilton Pond 06/14/14 (What Is The Piedmont?) ["Bill Hilton Jr. (RESEARCH)" ]
3 Jul Hilton Pond 06/14/14 (What Is The Piedmont?) ["Bill Hilton Jr. (RESEARCH)" ]
3 Jul Re: Where to go in early August between Ontario and Virginia? ["Patrick C. Hodgson" ]
3 Jul Where to go in early August between Ontario and Virginia? [Morten Gnther ]
2 Jul Link to story about European raptor poaching ["Barry K. MacKay" ]
2 Jul Belgian court judgement on illegal trade in birds of prey ["Barry K. MacKay" ]

Subject: Hilton Pond 07/01/14 (Midsummer Harvest)
From: "Bill Hilton Jr. (RESEARCH)" <research AT HILTONPOND.ORG>
Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2014 20:39:25 -0400
Some flora wait until autumn to yield fruit, but many roadside species already 
have ripened seeds that are capable of propagation. "This Week at Hilton Pond" 
we took a stroll to see just what plants was part of "hot weather harvest." 


To view what we found, please see the photo essay for 1-15 Jul 2014 
athttp://www.hiltonpond.org/ThisWeek140701.html . We include comments about 
pollinators that brought about the cornucopia and discuss some of the plants' 
importance to birds and other wildlife. 


While there, don't forget to scroll down for a list of all birds banded or 
recaptured during the period--plus some miscellaneous nature notes. 


Happy (Midsummer) Nature Watching!

BILL

P.S. Please "Like" our new Facebook page at http://www.facebook.com/HiltonPond 
for timely updates on nature topics. Follow us on Twitter  AT hiltonpond. 


=========

RESEARCH PROGRAM
c/o BILL HILTON JR., D.Sci.
Executive Director
Hilton Pond Center for Piedmont Natural History
1432 DeVinney Road, York, South Carolina 29745 USA
office & cell (803) 684-5852

Please visit our web sites (courtesy of Comporium.net):
Hilton Pond Center for Piedmont Natural History at http://www.hiltonpond.org 
"Operation RubyThroat: The Hummingbird Project" at http://www.rubythroat.org

==================


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Subject: RFI: Apps for UK birding
From: donald lewis <donlewis AT COMCAST.NET>
Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2014 17:30:32 -0700
As would be expected, there are a bunch of apps for birds of the UK and
Europe. I'm going to Wales next month and would like an app or two to help
me, mainly, in identifying songs and calls. I use  iPhone5 and iPad mini and
the songs should be playable on them. I don't need to take notes digitally.
I still use a hard copy field guide, so it's ease of use of the sounds more
than paintings that interests me.



Any recommendations?



Thanks,



Don Lewis

Lafayette, CA












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Subject: ABA event in Colorado
From: Rick Wright <birdaz AT GMAIL.COM>
Date: Mon, 28 Jul 2014 10:00:07 -0400
Mark your calendars if you're in or planning to be in Colorado August 9!

http://blog.aba.org/2014/07/aba-hosting-thank-you-colorado-event-august-9.html

Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey 
ABA Field Guide to Birds of New Jersey

 


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Subject: 30 Years With Hummingbirds
From: "Bill Hilton Jr. (RESEARCH)" <research AT HILTONPOND.ORG>
Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2014 20:25:23 -0400
Another big celebration today at Hilton Pond Center:

Exactly 30 years ago (27 Jul 1984) I received authorization from the federal 
Bird Banding Lab to begin working with hummingbirds. At 3 p.m. that afternoon I 
pulled the string on my homemade trap baited with sugar water and caught my 
very first hummer--a recently fledged male Ruby-throated Hummingbird that 
received band X37373. 


In three decades since I've banded 4,920 RTHU at the Center, with more than 12% 
of them returning in at least one later year. I've learned a lot about about 
hummer longevity, site fidelity, population dynamics, and migration, and I've 
derived quite a bit of personal and professional pleasure from these tiny balls 
of fluff. 


Among other things, my interest in ruby-throats has introduced me to a 
cherished assemblage of students and hummingbird enthusiasts--including those 
who have been with me on Operation RubyThroat expeditions to five Central 
American countries where I've banded 1,113 hummers. I am grateful for all those 
friends here and abroad and for the hummingbirds that have taught me much about 
the natural world of which we all are part, and I'm particularly indebted to 
fellow banders who have offered suggestions and support. At 67, I doubt I'll 
have another 30 years working with ruby-throats, but I'm not about to quit just 
yet! 


Happy Hummingbirding!

BILL

P.S. Please "Like" our new Facebook page at http://www.facebook.com/HiltonPond 
for timely updates on nature topics. Follow us on Twitter  AT hiltonpond. 


=========

RESEARCH PROGRAM
c/o BILL HILTON JR., D.Sci.
Executive Director
Hilton Pond Center for Piedmont Natural History
1432 DeVinney Road, York, South Carolina 29745 USA
office & cell (803) 684-5852

Please visit our web sites (courtesy of Comporium.net):
Hilton Pond Center for Piedmont Natural History at http://www.hiltonpond.org 
"Operation RubyThroat: The Hummingbird Project" at http://www.rubythroat.org

==================


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
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Subject: Cuvier's kinglet
From: Rick Wright <birdaz AT GMAIL.COM>
Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2014 10:25:39 -0400
I've thrown together a few notes about the "survival" of the Cuvier's
kinglet in the nineteenth century; you can read them as the beginnings of
another chapter in the history of ornithological suggestibility, or as a
reminder of the days when even in the well-birded US and Canada we just
weren't sure what might still be out there waiting for us.
http://birdaz.com/blog/2014/07/27/cuviers-kinglet-again/

Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Birding New Jersey 
ABA Field Guide to Birds of New Jersey

 


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Subject: BirdNote, last week & the week of July 27, 2014
From: Ellen Blackstone <ellen AT 123IMAGINE.NET>
Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2014 08:11:29 -0700
Hello, BirdChat,

A Peregrine Falcon eats on the wing... /on the fly, /so to speak. Check
out Gregg Thompson's photos!
http://bit.ly/1rHEorX
-----------------------------------------
Last week, BirdNote aired:

* Chuck Pettis: Earth Sanctuary, With a Plan for the Next 500 Years
http://bit.ly/1piyXfy

* Night Singers - Who's Out There?
http://bit.ly/OWxLgN

* Fruit as a Bribe
http://bit.ly/1nHiIsK

* Killdeer, Master of Distraction - The Ol' Broken Wing Act
http://bit.ly/1piz2A7

* Sanctuary and Bird Sound, With Gold Star Mother, Patti McLead
http://bit.ly/WUF3sY

* Gray Jay, Picnic Bird - Hang On to Your Sandwich!
http://bit.ly/1zfrWjX

* Birds That Say Their Own Names
http://bit.ly/P9K9eA

------------------------------------------------------------
View the photos and links for next week's shows: http://bit.ly/1AjlCJG

------------------------------------------------------------
Find us on Facebook. Search for birdnote.
... or Follow us on Twitter. Search for birdnoteradio
=========================================
You can listen to the mp3, see a photo, and read the transcript for a
show, plus sign up for weekly mail or the podcast, and find related
resources on the website. http://www.birdnote.org You'll find nearly
1200 episodes in the archive.

Thanks for listening!
Ellen Blackstone, BirdNote

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Subject: truly concerning bird news!
From: Devorah the Ornithologist <birdologist AT GMAIL.COM>
Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2014 09:03:33 +0100
hey everyone,

ian paulson just sent me the link to this Seattle Times story by the
brilliant Seattle Times environmental journalist, Craig Welch:

http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2024155783_birddeclinesxml.html

i am stunned, especially as we as a nation now are nearly face-to-face the
dreaded centennial of the extinction of the passenger pigeon (and other
iconic north american wildlife, such as the carolina parakeet and Rocky
Mountain locust, just to name a few).

i would be most interested to know what your reactions are, whether any of
you have or are participating in these bird surveys along the washington
coast, and whether these dramatic declines represent shifting baselines for
you? i certainly remember huge flocks of western grebes and large numbers
of seaducks and fairly large numbers of loons ... but it appears my
personal memories are not only distant in space, but also in time, and that
i may be in for a heartbreaking shock if i return.

--
GrrlScientist
Devorah Bennu, PhD
birdologist AT gmail.com
http://about.me/grrlscientist 
http://www.grrlscientist.net/
http://twitter.com/GrrlScientist
http://www.theguardian.com/science/grrlscientist

*sunt lacrimae rerum et mentem mortalia tangunt. [*Virgil, *Aeneid*, 1.461
ff.]

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Subject: the Rathbone warbler
From: Rick Wright <birdaz AT GMAIL.COM>
Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2014 12:55:36 -0400
Audubon never tells us "why" he thought it was new, but presumably he was
confused by the absence of breast streaking in the specimen he aged and
sexed as an adult male.

He retained the species through the Synopsis and the octavo edition alike;
Nuttall, Richardson, and Gray also treat it as valid.

To my knowledge, the last mention of rathbonia as a distinct species was in
Bonaparte's Conspectus of 1850 -- I think pretty much everyone else had
figured out by then that these were just yellow warblers.

Eager to hear what others know.
--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey 
ABA Field Guide to Birds of New Jersey

 


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Subject: Rathbone Warbler
From: Paul Rakow <rakow AT SUNE.AMTP.LIV.AC.UK>
Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2014 16:46:25 +0100
   Dear All,

       As a resident of Liverpool, the Audubon species that
  I wonder about is the Rathbone Warbler. Are there any thoughts
  on why he claimed this as a new species?

           Paul Rakow

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Subject: The owl who liked sitting on caesar
From: Devorah the Ornithologist <birdologist AT GMAIL.COM>
Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2014 16:04:41 +0100
hello everyone,

i just published my review of a witty and educational memoir about a man
who shared his london home with a tawny owl. This interesting book will
delight adults and young people on summer holidays and may also be an early
addition to one's christmas shopping list:


http://www.theguardian.com/science/grrlscientist/2014/jul/24/owl-who-liked-sitting-on-caesar-martin-windrow-book-review 


cheers,

--
GrrlScientist
Devorah Bennu, PhD
birdologist AT gmail.com
http://about.me/grrlscientist 
http://www.grrlscientist.net/
http://twitter.com/GrrlScientist
http://www.theguardian.com/science/grrlscientist

*sunt lacrimae rerum et mentem mortalia tangunt. [*Virgil, *Aeneid*, 1.461
ff.]

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Subject: Re: Carbonated Warbler
From: Jerry Friedman <jerryfriedman1 AT GMAIL.COM>
Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2014 08:13:14 -0600
There used to be a page with interesting discussion of the Bird of
Washington, but I can't find it now.  Anyway, my opinion, for what it's
worth, is that a thorough analysis of Audubon's "mystery birds" has to
consider all of them, which doesn't mean the answer is the same for all of
them.  It also has to consider how he hoaxed Rafinesque into describing
nonexistent species as well as other evidence of his dishonesty.  And it
still probably can't reach any definite conclusions.

Jerry Friedman
Española, New Mexico


On Tue, Jul 22, 2014 at 7:19 PM, Al Schirmacher 
wrote:

> What is the current thinking about Audubon's Carbonated Warbler?
>
> My thanks.
>
> Al Schirmacher
> Muscotah, KS
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
> Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
>

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Subject: carbonated warbler
From: Rick Wright <birdaz AT GMAIL.COM>
Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2014 09:19:15 -0400
I assume you've read the comments here; Louis Bevier's are especially
helpful (note the correct spelling of "Jardine"):

http://sibleyguides.blogspot.com/2008/03/audubons-mysteries-carbonated-swamp.html 


--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey 
ABA Field Guide to Birds of New Jersey

 


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Subject: Carbonated Warbler
From: Al Schirmacher <alschirmacher AT LIVE.COM>
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2014 20:19:55 -0500
What is the current thinking about Audubon's Carbonated Warbler?

My thanks.

Al Schirmacher
Muscotah, KS

Sent from my iPhone

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Subject: Cormorant In Japan
From: Eric Jeffrey <ecj100 AT AOL.COM>
Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2014 10:29:54 -0400
While taking the bus from Tokyo to Narita airport recently, at the end of a 
little-birding business trip, I saw a large cormorant fly across the front of 
the bus. I did not see it well enough to count, but am curious if there is any 
likelihood during the summer of it being anything other than a Temminck's 
Cormorant. The range maps in Mark Brazil's book suggest that they would be the 
only cormorant there at the time. 


Thanks for any light you can shed.

Eric Jeffrey
Falls Church, VA

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Subject: Birding Community E-bulletin - July 2014
From: Barbara Volkle and Steve Moore <barb620 AT THEWORLD.COM>
Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2014 12:09:54 -0400
The July 2014 issue of the Birding Community E-bulletin is now
available the web, covering news and issues relevant to birders.

Please share with birders you know!

Scroll to the bottom for information on how to subscribe directly.

Barbara Volkle
Northborough, MA
barb620 AT theworld.com

* * *

This Birding Community E-bulletin is designed for active and
concerned birders, those dedicated to the joys of birding and the
protection of birds and their habitats.

This issue is sponsored by the producers of superb quality birding
binoculars and scopes, Carl Zeiss Sport Optics:

http://sportsoptics.zeiss.com/nature/en_us/home.html 


You can access this issue and the archive of past E-bulletins on the
website of the National Wildlife Refuge Association (NWRA):

http://refugeassociation.org/news/birding-bulletin/ 




The July 2014 edition includes the following topics:

RARITY FOCUS
   - rarities in Alaska last month and Berylline Hummingbird in AZ

ATLASING SURPRISE
   - Florida's Bananaquit

BOBWHITE CONCERNS, BOBWHITE MEETING
   - has experienced a severe decline over a number of decades
     and a new plan

IMBD FUTURE THEMES IDEAS
   - International Migratory Bird Day (IMBD) - help decide the theme

BOOK NOTES: IN YOUR OWN BACKYARD
   - Douglas Tallamy and Rick Darke - how native plants play
important
     roles in gardens - how plants, insects, and birds interact

UTAH'S FIRST MODERN NESTING CALIFORNIA CONDORS
   - a California Condor hatched in the wild in Utah

ACCESS MATTERS: OFFICIAL THANK-YOU
   - make sure that the host, the owner, or the manager
     is thanked

TRICOLORED BLACKBIRDS CONTINUE TO BE IN TROUBLE
   - continue to live primarily in the southern portion of the
Central Valley
     of California but their numbers are rapidly decreasing

REMOTE PACIFIC MONUMENT/SANCTUARY ANNOUNCED
   - could create the world's largest marine sanctuary - would expand

     to nearly 782,000 square miles - comment period open

ANOTHER BUDGET CONCERN: NAWCA
   - North American Wetlands Conservation Act (NAWCA) and its
     importance in supporting on-the-ground bird conservation - every

     federal dollar provided must be matched

FIRST INTERNATIONAL BIRD OBSERVATORY CONFERENCE
   - will highlight the roles of bird observatories in research,
environmental
     monitoring, conservation projects, and providing information and

     service to the public

NEW DIRECTOR FOR CMBO
   - David La Puma will be the new director of the Cape May Bird
     Observatory

TIP OF THE MONTH: SUN PROTECTION
   - sunscreens and sunblocks and while you're at it, also wear a
hat!

- - - - - - - -

You can access past E-bulletins on the National Wildlife Refuge
Association (NWRA) website:

http://refugeassociation.org/news/birding-bulletin/ 



If you wish to receive the bulletin or have any friends or co-workers

who want to get onto the monthly E-bulletin mailing list, have them
contact either:

Wayne R. Petersen
Director Massachusetts Important Bird Areas (IBA)
Program Mass Audubon
wpetersen-at-massaudubon.org

Paul J. Baicich
Great Birding Projects
paul.baicich-at-verizon.net

If you wish to distribute all or parts of any of the monthly Birding
Community E-bulletins, they simply request that you mention the
source
of any material used. (Include a URL for the E-bulletin archives, if
possible.)

We never lend or sell our E-bulletin recipient list.

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Birding Community E-bulletin - June 2014
From: Barbara Volkle and Steve Moore <barb620 AT THEWORLD.COM>
Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2014 12:04:12 -0400
The June 2014 issue of the Birding Community E-bulletin is now
available the web, covering news and issues relevant to birders.

Please share with birders you know!

Scroll to the bottom for information on how to subscribe directly.

Barbara Volkle
Northborough, MA
barb620 AT theworld.com

* * *

This Birding Community E-bulletin is designed for active and
concerned birders, those dedicated to the joys of birding and the
protection of birds and their habitats.

This issue is sponsored by the producers of superb quality birding
binoculars and scopes, Carl Zeiss Sport Optics:

http://sportsoptics.zeiss.com/nature/en_us/home.html 


You can access this issue and the archive of past E-bulletins on the
website of the National Wildlife Refuge Association (NWRA):

http://refugeassociation.org/news/birding-bulletin/ 




The June 2014 edition includes the following topics:

RARITY FOCUS
   - Newfoundland, European Golden-Plovers, Black-tailed Godwits and
a Common
     Redshank were the byproduct of easterly winds blowing across the

     North Atlantic at the end of April and into May

IBA NEWS: CHESAPEAKE WATERBIRD PLAN
   - a comprehensive, state-of-the-art monitoring plan for the bay

"MOONBIRD" MAKES ANOTHER APPEARANCE
   - one Red Knot at the famous stopover site of the Delaware Bay for
21 years

BOOK NOTES: FOR NEW BIRDERS
   - Bill Thompson, III 's The New Birder's Guide to Birds of North
America
     geared to the introductory birder, regardless of age

ACCESS MATTERS: OHIO'S ROCK WREN
   - birders were welcomed

CONCERN FOR WESTERN GREBES IN CANADA
   - wintering populations have undergone a 44 percent decline from
     1995 to 2010

BIRD SMUGGLER ARRESTED AT CUBAN AIRPORT
   - arrest of a passenger with 66 Cuban Grassquits in his possession


ANOTHER BUDGET CONCERN: NEOTROP
   - the Neotropical Migratory Bird Conservation Act (NMBCA) and its
     importance in supporting hemispheric bird conservation

HAPPY 80th BIRTHDAY, HAWK MOUNTAIN
   - Eighty years ago, in June 1934, Rosalie Edge, her son Peter
     Edge, initiated the world's first refuge for birds of prey

TIP OF THE MONTH: USE THE STRAP
   - make sure the strap is around your neck

- - - - - - - -

You can access past E-bulletins on the National Wildlife Refuge
Association (NWRA) website:

http://refugeassociation.org/news/birding-bulletin/ 



If you wish to receive the bulletin or have any friends or co-workers

who want to get onto the monthly E-bulletin mailing list, have them
contact either:

Wayne R. Petersen
Director Massachusetts Important Bird Areas (IBA)
Program Mass Audubon
wpetersen-at-massaudubon.org

Paul J. Baicich
Great Birding Projects
paul.baicich-at-verizon.net

If you wish to distribute all or parts of any of the monthly Birding
Community E-bulletins, they simply request that you mention the
source
of any material used. (Include a URL for the E-bulletin archives, if
possible.)

We never lend or sell our E-bulletin recipient list.


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: Birders should return to observation instead of...
From: Alvaro Jaramillo <chucao AT COASTSIDE.NET>
Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2014 20:03:57 -0700
Jerry

 Difficult to test outright, but at the San Francisco Bird Observatory we have 
populations of wintering sparrows where a large proportion we have banded and 
re-caught multiple times. We have estimated survival rate for the sparrows, and 
compared it to migration distance (from how far they came) and essentially 
migration distance did not have an effect (there is a paper on this if anyone 
is interested). So these birds are not all that vulnerable, they can be handled 
multiple times a year and all is ok. We capture some of these birds year after 
year after year. The longevity records of birds are of course all from banded 
birds, we would not know anything about survival if it was not for banding. The 
only reason we know anything about survival in birds is because of banding! 


Regards,

Alvaro

Alvaro Jaramillo
alvaro AT alvarosadventures.com
www.alvarosadventures.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line) 
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Jerry Friedman 

Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2014 3:07 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] Birders should return to observation instead of...

To me the most interesting thing about the article was the suggestion that 
mist-netting birds during southern migration decreases their chances of 
survival. In addition to the humanitarian concern in the article, this would 
give scientifically biased results. Is there any data to support Marlene 
Condon's suggestion? Is there even any way to test it--which as far as I can 
see would require some way to measure birds' survival rates independent of 
banding? If there's something to it, is there any practical way to feed banded 
birds to make up for their lost fat? 


Jerry Friedman
Española, New Mexico

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

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Subject: BirdNote, last week & the week of July 20, 2014
From: Ellen Blackstone <ellen AT 123IMAGINE.NET>
Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2014 10:47:46 -0700
Hello, BirdChat,

Last week, BirdNote aired:

* Turkey Vulture - Sky Sailor
http://bit.ly/13fQAnf

* The Stock Tank - A Southwestern Oasis
http://bit.ly/LA6Kjb

* David Sibley - Sketching and Painting Impressions of Birds

(With a link to the video of David doing a sketch)
http://bit.ly/1wJaCkp

* Message of the Mourning Dove
http://bit.ly/Ui0VNj

* What Do Desert Birds Drink? - With a gorgeous photo of a
Black-throated Sparrow!
http://bit.ly/Wrfekp

* Birds on the Menu - Fun on Friday
http://bit.ly/1u31US2

* Gaping Blackbirds, By Gordon Orians, Icterid expert
http://bit.ly/1kGvx1Y

------------------------------------------------------------
View the photos and links for next week's shows: http://p0.vresp.com/zSuZuY
------------------------------------------------------------
Find us on Facebook. Search for birdnote.
... or Follow us on Twitter. Search for birdnoteradio
=========================================
You can listen to the mp3, see a photo, and read the transcript for a
show, plus sign up for weekly mail or the podcast, and find related
resources on the website. http://www.birdnote.org You'll find nearly
1200 episodes in the archive.

Thanks for listening!
Ellen Blackstone, BirdNote

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Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: BIRDCHAT Digest - 16 Jul 2014 to 17 Jul 2014 (#2014-152)
From: lamont AT GVII.CC
Date: Fri, 18 Jul 2014 12:17:20 +0000
How true and so eloquently stated.

Lamont Brown
Denton and Harlingen, Tx
Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

-----Original Message-----
From: BIRDCHAT automatic digest system 
Sender: "National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)" 
 

Date:     Fri, 18 Jul 2014 00:00:22
To: 
Reply-To: "National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)"
          
Subject: BIRDCHAT Digest - 16 Jul 2014 to 17 Jul 2014 (#2014-152)

There are 3 messages totalling 198 lines in this issue.

Topics of the day:

  1. The Swallows are Getting Ready to Leave
  2. yellow-breasted chat (2)

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 17 Jul 2014 08:57:08 -0800
From:    Joyanne Hamilton 
Subject: The Swallows are Getting Ready to Leave

Infinity; the outward and spiraling migration of time and elements through an 
incomprehensible vast area of space, forever leaving, returning, cycling, 
repeating in helixes, fractilizations and connections beyond our shallow minds. 


It makes no sense; we are not able to conceive an endpoint, a termination. The 
speed at which infinity travels in the universe can't even be measured as there 
are too many variables, accelerations, decelerations, matter bumping against 
matter, elements bonding or blasting apart for infinity, forever and forever. 




I used to think that part of this infinity on our tiny speck of life-blue in 
the infinity of space are the migrations of fish, animals, turtles, spiders, 
butterflies, birds and humans. As individuals we are finite yet infinite in a 
way in which our body's decay becomes nutritious food for the continuance of 
life and the continued pursuit of living, continually migrating, continually 
connecting, continually impacting infinity. 




As much as I'd like swallows to remain and amaze me with their aerobatics and 
hear their chatters, they are part of the cycle, the spiral of infinity. I've 
learned that when they perch on our wires in great numbers like this, their 
babies have left their mud nests, their hole-in-the-tree nests, their cliff 
homes and by next week 1/2 of the swallows will be gone from my skies and 
journeying through other skies, some other place relieving the world of its 
mosquitoes and insects someplace else. 




I have learned that migrations of a species are not permanent, not infinite, 
migrations can and will have an ending. We have watched, terrified as species 
of salmon have declined to the point of being listed as "endangered", their 
migrations petering off to where WE can see a finite end. Our physical, 
cultural and spiritual dependency on the migrations of these great fish that 
have been around for centuries upon centuries terminating and with their finite 
end taking a large piece of us as well. In many ways and ending to a migration 
can be an ending to US. What we thought was infinite is not. 




Infinity; the process is complicated, matter bumping against matter, elements 
bonding with other elements, life dying as nutrients and being reborn as life, 
water recycling, magnetism attracting, gravity pulling, animals and birds 
cycling through their migrations here on this earth alone. 




They say someday all life on earth and the earth itself will be caught up in 
the ultimate change, a massive explosion of matter or a burning off of our 
atmosphere that once had a beginning creation. Will infinity be done THEN? As 
our collective remnants and histories hurtle through space, through infinity, 
will our parts become part of another infinity, another cycle someplace else, 
spiraling, cycling, fractiling, and changing? Our God and Creator has the 
master plan, I believe this to be true above all else. 




For now, in my own finite speck of life, I will watch the swallows leaving with 
a lump in my throat and have faith that they will return again next spring. My 
own infinity is limited in the expanse of my own finite life and what will 
become of the migratory life here on earth will become part of another infinity 
that only God knows. 


 Joyanne Hamilton

Shageluk, Alaska

"If I had to choose, I would rather have birds than airplanes." --Charles 
Lindbergh 



BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 17 Jul 2014 14:47:24 -0700
From:    Alvaro Jaramillo 
Subject: Re: yellow-breasted chat

Richard,

  Not a blackbird, not a warbler, not an anything. A proposal out there will
be to give it its own family. The confusing part is that the family would
become Icteriadae, or was it Icteriidae if I remember correctly (genus
Icteria), which is amazingly similar to the new world blackbirds
(Icteridae). Confusing!

Alvaro

Alvaro Jaramillo
alvaro AT alvarosadventures.com
www.alvarosadventures.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Richard Carlson
Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2014 9:44 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] yellow-breasted chat

It's a blackbird?   Great article .

Richard Carlson
Tucson & Lake Tahoe
Sent from my iPhone


> On Jul 11, 2014, at 6:02 AM, Rick Wright  wrote:
>
> Nowadays, we all "know" that the chat isn't "really" a warbler. But
> whose idea was that in the first place?
>
> I've put together a quick summary of the chat's changing place in the
> ornithological mind -- accompanied by lots of pretty pictures.
>
> http://birdaz.com/blog/2014/07/11/who-made-that-bird-a-warbler-anyhow/
>
> --
> Rick Wright
> Bloomfield, NJ
>
> Review Editor, Birding 
> Senior Leader, WINGS 
> Birding New Jersey  ABA Field Guide to
> Birds of New Jersey
>  35622420/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1401460984&sr=8-1&keywords=aba+field+g
> uide+birds+new+jersey>
>
> BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
> Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

------------------------------

Date:    Thu, 17 Jul 2014 19:39:48 -0400
From:    "Spector, David (Biology)" 
Subject: Re: yellow-breasted chat

I think that the Yellow-breasted Chat belongs in the family Joculariidae, the 
jester-birds, along with Acorn Woodpeckers and male Bobolinks. 


David

David Spector
Belchertown, Massachusetts, U.S.
________________________________________
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line) 
[BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Alvaro Jaramillo 
[chucao AT COASTSIDE.NET] 

Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2014 5:47 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] yellow-breasted chat

Richard,

  Not a blackbird, not a warbler, not an anything. A proposal out there will
be to give it its own family. The confusing part is that the family would
become Icteriadae, or was it Icteriidae if I remember correctly (genus
Icteria), which is amazingly similar to the new world blackbirds
(Icteridae). Confusing!

Alvaro

Alvaro Jaramillo
alvaro AT alvarosadventures.com
www.alvarosadventures.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Richard Carlson
Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2014 9:44 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] yellow-breasted chat

It's a blackbird?   Great article .

Richard Carlson
Tucson & Lake Tahoe
Sent from my iPhone


> On Jul 11, 2014, at 6:02 AM, Rick Wright  wrote:
>
> Nowadays, we all "know" that the chat isn't "really" a warbler. But
> whose idea was that in the first place?
>
> I've put together a quick summary of the chat's changing place in the
> ornithological mind -- accompanied by lots of pretty pictures.
>
> http://birdaz.com/blog/2014/07/11/who-made-that-bird-a-warbler-anyhow/
>
> --
> Rick Wright
> Bloomfield, NJ
>
> Review Editor, Birding 
> Senior Leader, WINGS 
> Birding New Jersey  ABA Field Guide to
> Birds of New Jersey
>  35622420/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1401460984&sr=8-1&keywords=aba+field+g
> uide+birds+new+jersey>
>
> BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
> Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
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------------------------------

End of BIRDCHAT Digest - 16 Jul 2014 to 17 Jul 2014 (#2014-152)
***************************************************************

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: yellow-breasted chat
From: "Spector, David (Biology)" <spectord AT MAIL.CCSU.EDU>
Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2014 19:39:48 -0400
I think that the Yellow-breasted Chat belongs in the family Joculariidae, the 
jester-birds, along with Acorn Woodpeckers and male Bobolinks. 


David

David Spector
Belchertown, Massachusetts, U.S.
________________________________________
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line) 
[BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Alvaro Jaramillo 
[chucao AT COASTSIDE.NET] 

Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2014 5:47 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] yellow-breasted chat

Richard,

  Not a blackbird, not a warbler, not an anything. A proposal out there will
be to give it its own family. The confusing part is that the family would
become Icteriadae, or was it Icteriidae if I remember correctly (genus
Icteria), which is amazingly similar to the new world blackbirds
(Icteridae). Confusing!

Alvaro

Alvaro Jaramillo
alvaro AT alvarosadventures.com
www.alvarosadventures.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Richard Carlson
Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2014 9:44 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] yellow-breasted chat

It's a blackbird?   Great article .

Richard Carlson
Tucson & Lake Tahoe
Sent from my iPhone


> On Jul 11, 2014, at 6:02 AM, Rick Wright  wrote:
>
> Nowadays, we all "know" that the chat isn't "really" a warbler. But
> whose idea was that in the first place?
>
> I've put together a quick summary of the chat's changing place in the
> ornithological mind -- accompanied by lots of pretty pictures.
>
> http://birdaz.com/blog/2014/07/11/who-made-that-bird-a-warbler-anyhow/
>
> --
> Rick Wright
> Bloomfield, NJ
>
> Review Editor, Birding 
> Senior Leader, WINGS 
> Birding New Jersey  ABA Field Guide to
> Birds of New Jersey
>  35622420/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1401460984&sr=8-1&keywords=aba+field+g
> uide+birds+new+jersey>
>
> BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
> Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: yellow-breasted chat
From: Alvaro Jaramillo <chucao AT COASTSIDE.NET>
Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2014 14:47:24 -0700
Richard,

  Not a blackbird, not a warbler, not an anything. A proposal out there will
be to give it its own family. The confusing part is that the family would
become Icteriadae, or was it Icteriidae if I remember correctly (genus
Icteria), which is amazingly similar to the new world blackbirds
(Icteridae). Confusing!

Alvaro

Alvaro Jaramillo
alvaro AT alvarosadventures.com
www.alvarosadventures.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Richard Carlson
Sent: Saturday, July 12, 2014 9:44 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] yellow-breasted chat

It's a blackbird?   Great article .

Richard Carlson
Tucson & Lake Tahoe
Sent from my iPhone


> On Jul 11, 2014, at 6:02 AM, Rick Wright  wrote:
>
> Nowadays, we all "know" that the chat isn't "really" a warbler. But
> whose idea was that in the first place?
>
> I've put together a quick summary of the chat's changing place in the
> ornithological mind -- accompanied by lots of pretty pictures.
>
> http://birdaz.com/blog/2014/07/11/who-made-that-bird-a-warbler-anyhow/
>
> --
> Rick Wright
> Bloomfield, NJ
>
> Review Editor, Birding 
> Senior Leader, WINGS 
> Birding New Jersey  ABA Field Guide to
> Birds of New Jersey
>  35622420/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1401460984&sr=8-1&keywords=aba+field+g
> uide+birds+new+jersey>
>
> BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
> Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: The Swallows are Getting Ready to Leave
From: Joyanne Hamilton <innoko_bird AT ME.COM>
Date: Thu, 17 Jul 2014 08:57:08 -0800
Infinity; the outward and spiraling migration of time and elements through an 
incomprehensible vast area of space, forever leaving, returning, cycling, 
repeating in helixes, fractilizations and connections beyond our shallow minds. 


It makes no sense; we are not able to conceive an endpoint, a termination. The 
speed at which infinity travels in the universe can't even be measured as there 
are too many variables, accelerations, decelerations, matter bumping against 
matter, elements bonding or blasting apart for infinity, forever and forever. 




I used to think that part of this infinity on our tiny speck of life-blue in 
the infinity of space are the migrations of fish, animals, turtles, spiders, 
butterflies, birds and humans. As individuals we are finite yet infinite in a 
way in which our body's decay becomes nutritious food for the continuance of 
life and the continued pursuit of living, continually migrating, continually 
connecting, continually impacting infinity. 




As much as I'd like swallows to remain and amaze me with their aerobatics and 
hear their chatters, they are part of the cycle, the spiral of infinity. I've 
learned that when they perch on our wires in great numbers like this, their 
babies have left their mud nests, their hole-in-the-tree nests, their cliff 
homes and by next week 1/2 of the swallows will be gone from my skies and 
journeying through other skies, some other place relieving the world of its 
mosquitoes and insects someplace else. 




I have learned that migrations of a species are not permanent, not infinite, 
migrations can and will have an ending. We have watched, terrified as species 
of salmon have declined to the point of being listed as "endangered", their 
migrations petering off to where WE can see a finite end. Our physical, 
cultural and spiritual dependency on the migrations of these great fish that 
have been around for centuries upon centuries terminating and with their finite 
end taking a large piece of us as well. In many ways and ending to a migration 
can be an ending to US. What we thought was infinite is not. 




Infinity; the process is complicated, matter bumping against matter, elements 
bonding with other elements, life dying as nutrients and being reborn as life, 
water recycling, magnetism attracting, gravity pulling, animals and birds 
cycling through their migrations here on this earth alone. 




They say someday all life on earth and the earth itself will be caught up in 
the ultimate change, a massive explosion of matter or a burning off of our 
atmosphere that once had a beginning creation. Will infinity be done THEN? As 
our collective remnants and histories hurtle through space, through infinity, 
will our parts become part of another infinity, another cycle someplace else, 
spiraling, cycling, fractiling, and changing? Our God and Creator has the 
master plan, I believe this to be true above all else. 




For now, in my own finite speck of life, I will watch the swallows leaving with 
a lump in my throat and have faith that they will return again next spring. My 
own infinity is limited in the expanse of my own finite life and what will 
become of the migratory life here on earth will become part of another infinity 
that only God knows. 


 Joyanne Hamilton

Shageluk, Alaska

"If I had to choose, I would rather have birds than airplanes." --Charles 
Lindbergh 



BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: BIRDCHAT Digest - 14 Jul 2014 to 15 Jul 2014 (#2014-150)
From: Plovrchick AT AOL.COM
Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2014 20:25:55 -0400
I've seen birders approach nesting sites that they were specifically told
NOT to approach (at a ABA convention in Oregon in 2003). I've seen birders
intent on photographing birds get way too close to birds, so I understand
the  comments made by the author of the Washington Post opinion piece.  While
that kind of birder might be the exception, they do exist. Excusing them by
 referring to them as minor irritants does not help the community-or the
birds.


In a message dated 7/16/2014 1:00:47 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
LISTSERV AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU writes:

There  are 2 messages totalling 88 lines in this issue.

Topics of the  day:

1. [EXTERNAL] [BIRDCHAT] Fish Crow in Door Co.  WI?
2. Birders should return to observation instead  of...

BirdChat Guidelines:  http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives:  http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date:   Tue, 15 Jul 2014 10:23:01 -0400
From:    "Gorton, Gregg"  
Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] [BIRDCHAT] Fish Crow in  Door Co. WI?

Likely an immature American Crow. Size is very hard to  judge if the bird
is there is no comparator nearby.  This is precisely  the time when the
newly-fledged Am Crows are out and about. Also, a  clue  to the Fish Crow is a
double nasal caw, not just single nasal  caws..

Good Birding,

Gregg

Gregg Gorton,

Narberth,  PA

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline  Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Rick  King
Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2014 12:25 AM
To:  BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] [BIRDCHAT] Fish Crow in Door  Co. WI?

I saw a smallish crow making a call with a strange, nasal  quality call fly
over our motel in Sister Bay. This is apparently way out of  the range of
fish crows according to the Sibley guide. Does anyone have any  opinion about
this? Could it have been a fish crow? I didn't have time to  pursue looking
for it anywhere else because it wasn't a birding  trip.

Rick King
Southfield MI

BirdChat Guidelines:  http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives:  http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines:  http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
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------------------------------

Date:   Tue, 15 Jul 2014 15:06:11 -0700
From:    Chuck &  Lillian 
Subject: Re: Birders should return to  observation instead of...

What I didn't like about the article is the  manner in which she
presents her cherry-picked evidence. Certainly the  bothersome events
she cites occur, some times, in some places, with some  people, but
they're presented as if birders everywhere are tromping  through
fields of feeding birds, annoying owls, pestering migrants with  mist
nets and leg rings, when they're not out just running and  ticking,
running and ticking.

There have been reports in the press  about tens of millions, if not
hundreds of millions or even billions (in  the US alone) of birds
killed by cats, vehicles or smashing into windows,  antennas,
telephone towers. While birders can make nuisances of themselves  to
the birds (and to other people), a topic which has often  been
discussed on this forum, when compared to the problems presented  by
non-birders, our foibles amount to a freckle on an  elephant.

There's nothing wrong with just sitting and watching a bird -  I do it
myself - but occasionally I do like to get out and tick off a  few
lifters. I might as well complain that gardeners such as the  author
(Marlene Condon) should cease their perpetual pestering of  garden
plants and local insects, and should simply sit and admire  whatever
nature sends their way.
Chuck Almdale
North Hills,  Ca.

>Date:    Mon, 14 Jul 2014 14:45:46  -0400
>From:    "B.G. Sloan"  
>Subject: Birders should return to  observation instead of (article)
>
>Just wondering what  birdchatters might think of this op-ed piece
>from the Washington  Post:
>
>"In a world where natural habitat is disappearing at an  alarming
>rate, humans have a responsibility to avoid deliberately  intruding on the
lives
>of animals that are barely hanging on as it is.  For the love of
>birds, let's stop birding and return to bird-watching  thereby putting the
>welfare of wildlife ahead of human  desires."
>Full text at: http://wapo.st/Wd5s5t
>Bernie  Sloan
>Highland Park, NJ

BirdChat Guidelines:  http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives:  http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

------------------------------

End  of BIRDCHAT Digest - 14 Jul 2014 to 15 Jul 2014  (#2014-150)
***************************************************************


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: Birders should return to observation instead of...
From: marys1000 <marys1000 AT WOH.RR.COM>
Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2014 18:39:46 -0400
Why I rarely if ever offer and id on sparrows and such.
And why I always secretly wonder if they are right when people id
sparrows and other hard to id birds on a quick glimpse:)

Marie, bird watcher, Fairborn OH

On 7/16/2014 6:00 PM, Barry K. MacKay wrote:
> Agreed.  I avoid being absolute about anything, no matter what.
>
> Barry
>
>
> Barry Kent MacKay
> Bird Artist, Illustrator
> Studio: (905)-472-9731
> http://www.barrykentmackay.ca
> mimus AT sympatico.ca
> Markham, Ontario, Canada
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
> [mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Richard Carlson
> Sent: July-16-14 5:21 PM
> To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
> Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] Birders should return to observation instead of...
>
>   Absolute certainty is a blessing of childhood and a curse in adulthood.
>
> Richard Carlson
> Full-time Birder, Biker and Rotarian
> Part-time Economist
> Tucson, AZ & Lake Tahoe, CA
> rccarl AT pacbell.net
> Tucson 520-760-4935
> Tahoe 530-581-0624
> Cell 650-280-2965
>
>
>> ________________________________
>> From: Chuck & Lillian 
>> To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
>> Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2014 12:48 PM
>> Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] Birders should return to observation instead of...
>>
>>
>> Hi William:
>>
>> I used to be religious and have believed many things during my life.
>> While now an atheist, I do think that, as Jesus said, "faith can move
>> mountains," although not in any literal sense. So being a "true
>> believer" has benefits to believers themselves, and may carry over into
>> the wider society when believers are motivated to act on their beliefs
>> to the benefit of their society. But belief has its down side; someone
>> once commented that "everyone makes mistakes, but to truly be evil, you
>> have to be religious." (I didn't look that up, so it's unlikely to be
>> correctly worded.)
>>
>> One of the things I no longer believe in is the feeling of certainty,
>> both of other's and my own. True believers are generally filled with
>> certainty about their passions and opinions. Such certainty can
>> motivate, but it is no guarantee that actions performed will be
>> beneficial to anyone. So I remain skeptical of anyone's certainty about
>> anything. Certainty may also cause one to be bombastic in speech and
>> writing. Some may be swayed by this; others not. I prefer to see some
>> evidence and avoid unsupportable statements.
>>
>> yours,
>> Chuck
>>
>> At 06:39 AM 7/16/2014, William Leigh wrote:
>>

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: Birders should return to observation instead of...
From: Jerry Friedman <jerryfriedman1 AT GMAIL.COM>
Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2014 16:06:56 -0600
To me the most interesting thing about the article was the suggestion that
mist-netting birds during southern migration decreases their chances of
survival.  In addition to the humanitarian concern in the article, this
would give scientifically biased results.  Is there any data to support
Marlene Condon's suggestion?  Is there even any way to test it--which as
far as I can see would require some way to measure birds' survival rates
independent of banding?  If there's something to it, is there any practical
way to feed banded birds to make up for their lost fat?

Jerry Friedman
Española, New Mexico

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: Birders should return to observation instead of...
From: "Barry K. MacKay" <mimus AT SYMPATICO.CA>
Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2014 18:00:47 -0400
Agreed.  I avoid being absolute about anything, no matter what.

Barry


Barry Kent MacKay
Bird Artist, Illustrator
Studio: (905)-472-9731
http://www.barrykentmackay.ca
mimus AT sympatico.ca
Markham, Ontario, Canada


-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Richard Carlson
Sent: July-16-14 5:21 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] Birders should return to observation instead of...

 Absolute certainty is a blessing of childhood and a curse in adulthood.

Richard Carlson
Full-time Birder, Biker and Rotarian
Part-time Economist
Tucson, AZ & Lake Tahoe, CA
rccarl AT pacbell.net
Tucson 520-760-4935
Tahoe 530-581-0624
Cell 650-280-2965


>________________________________
> From: Chuck & Lillian 
>To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
>Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2014 12:48 PM
>Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] Birders should return to observation instead of...
>
>
>Hi William:
>
>I used to be religious and have believed many things during my life.
>While now an atheist, I do think that, as Jesus said, "faith can move
>mountains," although not in any literal sense. So being a "true
>believer" has benefits to believers themselves, and may carry over into
>the wider society when believers are motivated to act on their beliefs
>to the benefit of their society. But belief has its down side; someone
>once commented that "everyone makes mistakes, but to truly be evil, you
>have to be religious." (I didn't look that up, so it's unlikely to be
>correctly worded.)
>
>One of the things I no longer believe in is the feeling of certainty,
>both of other's and my own. True believers are generally filled with
>certainty about their passions and opinions. Such certainty can
>motivate, but it is no guarantee that actions performed will be
>beneficial to anyone. So I remain skeptical of anyone's certainty about
>anything. Certainty may also cause one to be bombastic in speech and
>writing. Some may be swayed by this; others not. I prefer to see some
>evidence and avoid unsupportable statements.
>
>yours,
>Chuck
>
>At 06:39 AM 7/16/2014, William Leigh wrote:
>>I know Marlene as an acquaintance and have always found her
>>interesting to talk to and very knowledgeable about nature in a much
>>broader sense then my own knowledge. She  is what I call a "True
>>Believer" someone who takes their position on an issue political,
>>religious or in this case "environmentalism" with a sort of blind
>>passion. A passion  that brooks no debate or second thoughts or doubts
>>in their correctness. I envy her in a way and I applaud her sentiment.
>>That said I think a world of good comes from banding birds and the
>>reporting of bird sightings. Some of that good comes in the form of
>>scientific knowledge and some comes in the form of changes to peoples
>>thinking and hearts as they  become more intimately involved in the
>>study of nature.   I understand her sentiment and believe them to be
>>sincere,  but another colder and more rationale part of me thinks that
>>the real fight- the strategic- fight involves global warming,  overall
>>habitat destruction, genetic tampering, overuse of pesticides   and
>>what birders do  is of small import one way or the other.
>>
>>best,
>>
>>William Leigh leightern AT msn.com
>>
>>Bridgewater, Virginia
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2014 15:06:11 -0700
>> > From: misclists AT VERIZON.NET
>> > Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] Birders should return to observation instead
of...
>> > To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
>> >
>> > What I didn't like about the article is the manner in which she
>> > presents her cherry-picked evidence. Certainly the bothersome
>> > events she cites occur, some times, in some places, with some
>> > people, but they're presented as if birders everywhere are tromping
>> > through fields of feeding birds, annoying owls, pestering migrants
>> > with mist nets and leg rings, when they're not out just running and
>> > ticking, running and ticking.
>> >
>> > There have been reports in the press about tens of millions, if not
>> > hundreds of millions or even billions (in the US alone) of birds
>> > killed by cats, vehicles or smashing into windows, antennas,
>> > telephone towers. While birders can make nuisances of themselves to
>> > the birds (and to other people), a topic which has often been
>> > discussed on this forum, when compared to the problems presented by
>> > non-birders, our foibles amount to a freckle on an elephant.
>> >
>> > There's nothing wrong with just sitting and watching a bird - I do
>> > it myself - but occasionally I do like to get out and tick off a
>> > few lifters. I might as well complain that gardeners such as the
>> > author (Marlene Condon) should cease their perpetual pestering of
>> > garden plants and local insects, and should simply sit and admire
>> > whatever nature sends their way.
>> > Chuck Almdale
>> > North Hills, Ca.
>> >
>> > >Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2014 14:45:46 -0400
>> > >From: "B.G. Sloan" 
>> > >Subject: Birders should return to observation instead of (article)
>> > >
>> > >Just wondering what birdchatters might think of this op-ed piece
>> > >from the Washington Post:
>> > >
>> > >"In a world where natural habitat is disappearing at an alarming
>> > >rate, humans have a responsibility to avoid deliberately
>> intruding on the lives
>> > >of animals that are barely hanging on as it is. For the love of
>> > >birds, let's stop birding and return to bird-watching thereby
>> > >putting the welfare of wildlife ahead of human desires."
>> > >Full text at: http://wapo.st/Wd5s5t Bernie Sloan Highland Park, NJ
>> >
>> > BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
>> > Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
>
>BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
>Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
>
>
>
BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: Birders should return to observation instead of...
From: Richard Carlson <rccarl AT PACBELL.NET>
Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2014 14:20:35 -0700
Absolute certainty is a blessing of childhood and a curse in adulthood.

Richard Carlson
Full-time Birder, Biker and Rotarian
Part-time Economist
Tucson, AZ & Lake Tahoe, CA
rccarl AT pacbell.net
Tucson 520-760-4935
Tahoe 530-581-0624
Cell 650-280-2965


>________________________________
> From: Chuck & Lillian 
>To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU 
>Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2014 12:48 PM
>Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] Birders should return to observation instead of...
> 
>
>Hi William:
>
>I used to be religious and have believed many things during my life.
>While now an atheist, I do think that, as Jesus said, "faith can move
>mountains," although not in any literal sense. So being a "true
>believer" has benefits to believers themselves, and may carry over
>into the wider society when believers are motivated to act on their
>beliefs to the benefit of their society. But belief has its down
>side; someone once commented that "everyone makes mistakes, but to
>truly be evil, you have to be religious." (I didn't look that up, so
>it's unlikely to be correctly worded.)
>
>One of the things I no longer believe in is the feeling of certainty,
>both of other's and my own. True believers are generally filled with
>certainty about their passions and opinions. Such certainty can
>motivate, but it is no guarantee that actions performed will be
>beneficial to anyone. So I remain skeptical of anyone's certainty
>about anything. Certainty may also cause one to be bombastic in
>speech and writing. Some may be swayed by this; others not. I prefer
>to see some evidence and avoid unsupportable statements.
>
>yours,
>Chuck
>
>At 06:39 AM 7/16/2014, William Leigh wrote:
>>I know Marlene as an acquaintance and have always found her
>>interesting to talk to and very knowledgeable about nature in a much
>>broader sense then my own knowledge. She is what I call a "True
>>Believer" someone who takes their position on an issue political,
>>religious or in this case "environmentalism" with a sort of blind
>>passion. A passion that brooks no debate or second thoughts or
>>doubts in their correctness. I envy her in a way and I applaud her
>>sentiment. That said I think a world of good comes from banding
>>birds and the reporting of bird sightings. Some of that good comes
>>in the form of scientific knowledge and some comes in the form of
>>changes to peoples thinking and hearts as they become more
>>intimately involved in the study of nature.  I understand her
>>sentiment and believe them to be sincere, but another colder and
>>more rationale part of me thinks that the real fight- the strategic-
>>fight involves global warming, overall habitat destruction, genetic
>>tampering, overuse of pesticides  and what birders do is of small
>>import one way or the other.
>>
>>best,
>>
>>William Leigh leightern AT msn.com
>>
>>Bridgewater, Virginia
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2014 15:06:11 -0700
>> > From: misclists AT VERIZON.NET
>> > Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] Birders should return to observation instead of...
>> > To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
>> >
>> > What I didn't like about the article is the manner in which she
>> > presents her cherry-picked evidence. Certainly the bothersome events
>> > she cites occur, some times, in some places, with some people, but
>> > they're presented as if birders everywhere are tromping through
>> > fields of feeding birds, annoying owls, pestering migrants with mist
>> > nets and leg rings, when they're not out just running and ticking,
>> > running and ticking.
>> >
>> > There have been reports in the press about tens of millions, if not
>> > hundreds of millions or even billions (in the US alone) of birds
>> > killed by cats, vehicles or smashing into windows, antennas,
>> > telephone towers. While birders can make nuisances of themselves to
>> > the birds (and to other people), a topic which has often been
>> > discussed on this forum, when compared to the problems presented by
>> > non-birders, our foibles amount to a freckle on an elephant.
>> >
>> > There's nothing wrong with just sitting and watching a bird - I do it
>> > myself - but occasionally I do like to get out and tick off a few
>> > lifters. I might as well complain that gardeners such as the author
>> > (Marlene Condon) should cease their perpetual pestering of garden
>> > plants and local insects, and should simply sit and admire whatever
>> > nature sends their way.
>> > Chuck Almdale
>> > North Hills, Ca.
>> >
>> > >Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2014 14:45:46 -0400
>> > >From: "B.G. Sloan" 
>> > >Subject: Birders should return to observation instead of (article)
>> > >
>> > >Just wondering what birdchatters might think of this op-ed piece
>> > >from the Washington Post:
>> > >
>> > >"In a world where natural habitat is disappearing at an alarming
>> > >rate, humans have a responsibility to avoid deliberately
>> intruding on the lives
>> > >of animals that are barely hanging on as it is. For the love of
>> > >birds, let's stop birding and return to bird-watching thereby putting the
>> > >welfare of wildlife ahead of human desires."
>> > >Full text at: http://wapo.st/Wd5s5t
>> > >Bernie Sloan
>> > >Highland Park, NJ
>> >
>> > BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
>> > Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
>
>BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
>Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
>
>
>
BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: Birders should return to observation instead of...
From: Chuck & Lillian <misclists AT VERIZON.NET>
Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2014 12:48:32 -0700
Hi William:

I used to be religious and have believed many things during my life.
While now an atheist, I do think that, as Jesus said, "faith can move
mountains," although not in any literal sense. So being a "true
believer" has benefits to believers themselves, and may carry over
into the wider society when believers are motivated to act on their
beliefs to the benefit of their society. But belief has its down
side; someone once commented that "everyone makes mistakes, but to
truly be evil, you have to be religious." (I didn't look that up, so
it's unlikely to be correctly worded.)

One of the things I no longer believe in is the feeling of certainty,
both of other's and my own. True believers are generally filled with
certainty about their passions and opinions. Such certainty can
motivate, but it is no guarantee that actions performed will be
beneficial to anyone. So I remain skeptical of anyone's certainty
about anything. Certainty may also cause one to be bombastic in
speech and writing. Some may be swayed by this; others not. I prefer
to see some evidence and avoid unsupportable statements.

yours,
Chuck

At 06:39 AM 7/16/2014, William Leigh wrote:
>I know Marlene as an acquaintance and have always found her
>interesting to talk to and very knowledgeable about nature in a much
>broader sense then my own knowledge. She  is what I call a "True
>Believer" someone who takes their position on an issue political,
>religious or in this case "environmentalism" with a sort of blind
>passion. A passion  that brooks no debate or second thoughts or
>doubts in their correctness. I envy her in a way and I applaud her
>sentiment. That said I think a world of good comes from banding
>birds and the reporting of bird sightings. Some of that good comes
>in the form of scientific knowledge and some comes in the form of
>changes to peoples thinking and hearts as they  become more
>intimately involved in the study of nature.   I understand her
>sentiment and believe them to be sincere,  but another colder and
>more rationale part of me thinks that the real fight- the strategic-
>fight involves global warming,  overall habitat destruction, genetic
>tampering, overuse of pesticides   and what birders do  is of small
>import one way or the other.
>
>best,
>
>William Leigh leightern AT msn.com
>
>Bridgewater, Virginia
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2014 15:06:11 -0700
> > From: misclists AT VERIZON.NET
> > Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] Birders should return to observation instead of...
> > To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
> >
> > What I didn't like about the article is the manner in which she
> > presents her cherry-picked evidence. Certainly the bothersome events
> > she cites occur, some times, in some places, with some people, but
> > they're presented as if birders everywhere are tromping through
> > fields of feeding birds, annoying owls, pestering migrants with mist
> > nets and leg rings, when they're not out just running and ticking,
> > running and ticking.
> >
> > There have been reports in the press about tens of millions, if not
> > hundreds of millions or even billions (in the US alone) of birds
> > killed by cats, vehicles or smashing into windows, antennas,
> > telephone towers. While birders can make nuisances of themselves to
> > the birds (and to other people), a topic which has often been
> > discussed on this forum, when compared to the problems presented by
> > non-birders, our foibles amount to a freckle on an elephant.
> >
> > There's nothing wrong with just sitting and watching a bird - I do it
> > myself - but occasionally I do like to get out and tick off a few
> > lifters. I might as well complain that gardeners such as the author
> > (Marlene Condon) should cease their perpetual pestering of garden
> > plants and local insects, and should simply sit and admire whatever
> > nature sends their way.
> > Chuck Almdale
> > North Hills, Ca.
> >
> > >Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2014 14:45:46 -0400
> > >From: "B.G. Sloan" 
> > >Subject: Birders should return to observation instead of (article)
> > >
> > >Just wondering what birdchatters might think of this op-ed piece
> > >from the Washington Post:
> > >
> > >"In a world where natural habitat is disappearing at an alarming
> > >rate, humans have a responsibility to avoid deliberately
> intruding on the lives
> > >of animals that are barely hanging on as it is. For the love of
> > >birds, let's stop birding and return to bird-watching thereby putting the
> > >welfare of wildlife ahead of human desires."
> > >Full text at: http://wapo.st/Wd5s5t
> > >Bernie Sloan
> > >Highland Park, NJ
> >
> > BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
> > Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: Birders should return to observation instead of...
From: "Tangren, Gerald Vernon" <tangren AT WSU.EDU>
Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2014 14:30:09 +0000
I attempted to read between the lines because she obviously has an issue
and an axe to grind. Unfortunately, that would involve projecting my
thought onto hers. I wouldnt take this too seriously because I believe
shes hiding hurts or whatever behind her choices of examples. Its just
unfortunate shes using the soapbox provided to her to vent some unseen
frustration.


Jerry 
WA State University-Tree Fruit Research & Extension Center
Wenatchee, WA
509-663-8181 x 231
USDA Cold Hardiness Zone 7a
http://www.tfrec.wsu.edu/pages/webdev/Favorites



"There are no 'ordinary' people. You have never talked to a mere mortal.
Nations, cultures, arts, civilizations -- these are mortal But it is
immortals whom we joke with, work with, marry, snub and exploit" -- C. S.
Lewis, From The Weight of Glory





On 7/15/14, 3:06 PM, "Chuck & Lillian"  wrote:

>What I didn't like about the article is the manner in which she
>presents her cherry-picked evidence.
>...

>>Date:    Mon, 14 Jul 2014 14:45:46 -0400
>>From:    "B.G. Sloan" 
>>Subject: Birders should return to observation instead of (article)
>>
>>Just wondering what birdchatters might think of this op-ed piece
>>from the Washington Post:
...
>>
>>
>>Full text at: http://wapo.st/Wd5s5t
>>Bernie Sloan
>>Highland Park, NJ
>
>BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
>Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: Birders should return to observation instead of...
From: William Leigh <leightern AT MSN.COM>
Date: Wed, 16 Jul 2014 13:39:28 +0000
I know Marlene as an acquaintance and have always found her interesting to talk 
to and very knowledgeable about nature in a much broader sense then my own 
knowledge. She is what I call a "True Believer" someone who takes their 
position on an issue political, religious or in this case "environmentalism" 
with a sort of blind passion. A passion that brooks no debate or second 
thoughts or doubts in their correctness. I envy her in a way and I applaud her 
sentiment. That said I think a world of good comes from banding birds and the 
reporting of bird sightings. Some of that good comes in the form of scientific 
knowledge and some comes in the form of changes to peoples thinking and hearts 
as they become more intimately involved in the study of nature. I understand 
her sentiment and believe them to be sincere, but another colder and more 
rationale part of me thinks that the real fight- the strategic- fight involves 
global warming, overall habitat destruction, genetic tampering, overuse of 
pesticides and what birders do is of small import one way or the other. 

best, 
William Leigh leightern AT msn.com

Bridgewater, Virginia 
 

 



> Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2014 15:06:11 -0700
> From: misclists AT VERIZON.NET
> Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] Birders should return to observation instead of...
> To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
> 
> What I didn't like about the article is the manner in which she
> presents her cherry-picked evidence. Certainly the bothersome events
> she cites occur, some times, in some places, with some people, but
> they're presented as if birders everywhere are tromping through
> fields of feeding birds, annoying owls, pestering migrants with mist
> nets and leg rings, when they're not out just running and ticking,
> running and ticking.
> 
> There have been reports in the press about tens of millions, if not
> hundreds of millions or even billions (in the US alone) of birds
> killed by cats, vehicles or smashing into windows, antennas,
> telephone towers. While birders can make nuisances of themselves to
> the birds (and to other people), a topic which has often been
> discussed on this forum, when compared to the problems presented by
> non-birders, our foibles amount to a freckle on an elephant.
> 
> There's nothing wrong with just sitting and watching a bird - I do it
> myself - but occasionally I do like to get out and tick off a few
> lifters. I might as well complain that gardeners such as the author
> (Marlene Condon) should cease their perpetual pestering of garden
> plants and local insects, and should simply sit and admire whatever
> nature sends their way.
> Chuck Almdale
> North Hills, Ca.
> 
> >Date:    Mon, 14 Jul 2014 14:45:46 -0400
> >From:    "B.G. Sloan" 
> >Subject: Birders should return to observation instead of (article)
> >
> >Just wondering what birdchatters might think of this op-ed piece
> >from the Washington Post:
> >
> >"In a world where natural habitat is disappearing at an alarming
> >rate, humans have a responsibility to avoid deliberately intruding on the 
lives 

> >of animals that are barely hanging on as it is. For the love of
> >birds, let's stop birding and return to bird-watching thereby putting the
> >welfare of wildlife ahead of human desires."
> >Full text at: http://wapo.st/Wd5s5t
> >Bernie Sloan
> >Highland Park, NJ
> 
> BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
> Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
 		 	   		  
BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: Birders should return to observation instead of...
From: Chuck & Lillian <misclists AT VERIZON.NET>
Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2014 15:06:11 -0700
What I didn't like about the article is the manner in which she
presents her cherry-picked evidence. Certainly the bothersome events
she cites occur, some times, in some places, with some people, but
they're presented as if birders everywhere are tromping through
fields of feeding birds, annoying owls, pestering migrants with mist
nets and leg rings, when they're not out just running and ticking,
running and ticking.

There have been reports in the press about tens of millions, if not
hundreds of millions or even billions (in the US alone) of birds
killed by cats, vehicles or smashing into windows, antennas,
telephone towers. While birders can make nuisances of themselves to
the birds (and to other people), a topic which has often been
discussed on this forum, when compared to the problems presented by
non-birders, our foibles amount to a freckle on an elephant.

There's nothing wrong with just sitting and watching a bird - I do it
myself - but occasionally I do like to get out and tick off a few
lifters. I might as well complain that gardeners such as the author
(Marlene Condon) should cease their perpetual pestering of garden
plants and local insects, and should simply sit and admire whatever
nature sends their way.
Chuck Almdale
North Hills, Ca.

>Date:    Mon, 14 Jul 2014 14:45:46 -0400
>From:    "B.G. Sloan" 
>Subject: Birders should return to observation instead of (article)
>
>Just wondering what birdchatters might think of this op-ed piece
>from the Washington Post:
>
>"In a world where natural habitat is disappearing at an alarming
>rate, humans have a responsibility to avoid deliberately intruding on the 
lives 

>of animals that are barely hanging on as it is. For the love of
>birds, let's stop birding and return to bird-watching thereby putting the
>welfare of wildlife ahead of human desires."
>Full text at: http://wapo.st/Wd5s5t
>Bernie Sloan
>Highland Park, NJ

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] [BIRDCHAT] Fish Crow in Door Co. WI?
From: "Gorton, Gregg" <Gregg.Gorton AT VA.GOV>
Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2014 10:23:01 -0400
Likely an immature American Crow. Size is very hard to judge if the bird is 
there is no comparator nearby. This is precisely the time when the 
newly-fledged Am Crows are out and about. Also, a clue to the Fish Crow is a 
double nasal caw, not just single nasal caws.. 


Good Birding,

Gregg

Gregg Gorton,

Narberth, PA

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line) 
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Rick King 

Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2014 12:25 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] [BIRDCHAT] Fish Crow in Door Co. WI?

I saw a smallish crow making a call with a strange, nasal quality call fly over 
our motel in Sister Bay. This is apparently way out of the range of fish crows 
according to the Sibley guide. Does anyone have any opinion about this? Could 
it have been a fish crow? I didn't have time to pursue looking for it anywhere 
else because it wasn't a birding trip. 


Rick King
Southfield MI

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Subject: Fish Crow in Door Co. WI?
From: Rick King <rickbking AT COMCAST.NET>
Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2014 00:24:51 -0400
I saw a smallish crow making a call with a strange, nasal quality call
fly over our motel in Sister Bay. This is apparently way out of the
range of fish crows according to the Sibley guide. Does anyone have any
opinion about this? Could it have been a fish crow? I didn't have time
to pursue looking for it anywhere else because it wasn't a birding trip.

Rick King
Southfield MI

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Subject: 6 day 3000 mile flight - Semipal Sandpiper
From: mitch AT UTOPIANATURE.COM
Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2014 13:31:32 -0700
https://www.manomet.org/newsletter/first-ever-geolocator-results-semipalmated-sandpiper-show-remarkable-year-long-odyssey 


Mitch Heindel
Utopia, Texas

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Subject: Post article about birding
From: Rick Wright <birdaz AT GMAIL.COM>
Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2014 16:09:33 -0400
"Nonsense" was not the word that escaped my mouth when I read Marlene
Condon's little essay, but it's the one I'll stick with here.

Her complaints about birding having evolved into listing are facile -- and
nearly half a century too late. She seems to have paid no attention to what
has been learned over the past thirty years about the demography and the
ecology of snowy owls at the southern edges of the wintering range. And
while I have my own disapproving thoughts about recreational and soi-disant
"educational" netting programs, she seems willing to dispose of the
bathwater while a very important baby -- well-designed and carefully
conducted scientific banding projects -- is still splashing in it.

Yes, there are clod birders. Yes, the connection between citizen "science"
and the resurgence of tick-and-run listing is something we should be
talking about, loud. And yes, yes, yes, we should all be supporting habitat
acquisition and management.

But this kind of "when-I-was-a-boy" nostalgia doesn't get any of that done,
does it?

Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Birding New Jersey 
ABA Field Guide to Birds of New Jersey

 


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Subject: Birders should return to observation instead of ‘c ollecting’ (article)
From: "B.G. Sloan" <bgsloan3 AT GMAIL.COM>
Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2014 14:45:46 -0400
Just wondering what birdchatters might think of this op-ed piece from the
Washington Post:

"In a world where natural habitat is disappearing at an alarming rate,
humans have a responsibility to avoid deliberately intruding on the lives
of animals that are barely hanging on as it is. For the love of birds,
let’s stop birding and return to bird-watching — thereby putting the
welfare of wildlife ahead of human desires."

Full text at: http://wapo.st/Wd5s5t

Bernie Sloan
Highland Park, NJ

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Subject: Re: yellow-breasted chat
From: Michael Wiegand <onwingsof_pearl AT HOTMAIL.COM>
Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2014 11:21:08 -0600
to me it more resembles a big, chatty vireo in form and mannerisms
great article as Richard noted
thanks for sharing Rick !

Michael Wiegand 
Pearl, Idaho 
 
208-859-3643-c 
208-286-0506-h 

www.habiscapes.com 

"the truth is out there!"

> Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2014 09:43:53 -0700
> From: rccarl AT PACBELL.NET
> Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] yellow-breasted chat
> To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
> 
> It's a blackbird?   Great article .
> 
> Richard Carlson
> Tucson & Lake Tahoe
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> 
> > On Jul 11, 2014, at 6:02 AM, Rick Wright  wrote:
> >
> > Nowadays, we all "know" that the chat isn't "really" a warbler. But whose
> > idea was that in the first place?
> >
> > I've put together a quick summary of the chat's changing place in the
> > ornithological mind -- accompanied by lots of pretty pictures.
> >
> > http://birdaz.com/blog/2014/07/11/who-made-that-bird-a-warbler-anyhow/
> >
> > --
> > Rick Wright
> > Bloomfield, NJ
> >
> > Review Editor, Birding 
> > Senior Leader, WINGS 
> > Birding New Jersey 
> > ABA Field Guide to Birds of New Jersey
> > 
 

> >
> > BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
> > Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
> 
> BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
> Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
 		 	   		  
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Subject: Re: yellow-breasted chat
From: Richard Carlson <rccarl AT PACBELL.NET>
Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2014 09:43:53 -0700
It's a blackbird?   Great article .

Richard Carlson
Tucson & Lake Tahoe
Sent from my iPhone


> On Jul 11, 2014, at 6:02 AM, Rick Wright  wrote:
>
> Nowadays, we all "know" that the chat isn't "really" a warbler. But whose
> idea was that in the first place?
>
> I've put together a quick summary of the chat's changing place in the
> ornithological mind -- accompanied by lots of pretty pictures.
>
> http://birdaz.com/blog/2014/07/11/who-made-that-bird-a-warbler-anyhow/
>
> --
> Rick Wright
> Bloomfield, NJ
>
> Review Editor, Birding 
> Senior Leader, WINGS 
> Birding New Jersey 
> ABA Field Guide to Birds of New Jersey
> 
 

>
> BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
> Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

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Subject: BirdNote, last week & the week of July 13, 2014
From: Ellen Blackstone <ellen AT 123IMAGINE.NET>
Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2014 07:31:05 -0700
Hello, BirdChat,

David Sibley visited the BirdNote studio and did a sketch while he was
there. Check it out! http://bit.ly/1kf2LFE
----------------------------------------------
Last week, BirdNote aired:

* Birds Need Water in Summer!
http://bit.ly/Nynu9w

* An Evening in Sapsucker Woods, With A.A. Allen
http://bit.ly/RO1Y1v

* Peter Matthiessen's "Wind Birds"
http://bit.ly/1m1Jbw8

* Seabirds Converge from the Ends of the Earth, Off North Carolina
http://bit.ly/1mHseLX

* Birdwatching 104 - A Summary
http://bit.ly/U6VPU9

* Loggerhead Shrike - A Songbird That's a Raptor!
http://bit.ly/1ors5t4

* Raven and the Sun, A Myth
http://bit.ly/1mSUlcy

------------------------------------------------------------
View the photos and links for next week's shows:
http://p0.vresp.com/jmQ0ms
------------------------------------------------------------
Find us on Facebook. Search for birdnote.
... or Follow us on Twitter. Search for birdnoteradio
=========================================
You can listen to the mp3, see a photo, and read the transcript for a
show, plus sign up for weekly mail or the podcast, and find related
resources on the website. http://www.birdnote.org You'll find nearly
1200 episodes in the archive.

Thanks for listening!
Ellen Blackstone, BirdNote

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Subject: yellow-breasted chat
From: Rick Wright <birdaz AT GMAIL.COM>
Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2014 09:02:38 -0400
Nowadays, we all "know" that the chat isn't "really" a warbler. But whose
idea was that in the first place?

I've put together a quick summary of the chat's changing place in the
ornithological mind -- accompanied by lots of pretty pictures.

http://birdaz.com/blog/2014/07/11/who-made-that-bird-a-warbler-anyhow/

--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey 
ABA Field Guide to Birds of New Jersey

 


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Subject: Interesting Blue Jay food choice
From: "B.G. Sloan" <bgsloan3 AT GMAIL.COM>
Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2014 19:07:25 -0400
I have two potted New Guinea Impatiens plants on my deck. One has pink
blossoms. The other has red blossoms. The pot with pink blossoms blooms
well, but the one with red blooms hasn't been doing so well. A red blossom
opens up and then disappears. The other day I saw a Blue Jay land on the
plant, pluck the red blossom, and then swallow it. Today I put the pots in
a storage shed. Later I saw a Blue Jay land on the deck railing looking
perplexed and confused when it couldn't find the plant...

Bernie Sloan
Highland Park, NJ

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Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn
From: "Gorton, Gregg" <Gregg.Gorton AT VA.GOV>
Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2014 13:01:02 -0400
Helen and all,

That's quite a story-- thanks for sharing it. The perils of bird recording are 
probably underappreciated, but it's absolutely typical of some of the diehard 
recordists that they would worry first about their equipment. Ted Parker once 
asked Bill Gunn how he dealt with blood dripping onto his equipment while 
standing stock still in the midst of a cloud of mosquitos while recording a 
rare bird. Gunn demurred, but I can imagine he might have said: "take your 
anti-malarial pill each day!" Irby Davis once had his equipment taken at 
gunpoint in Mexico, but was able to recover it by complaining to the local 
authorities. Peter Boesman did almost all of his recording in South America 
after he barely survived a Bushmaster bite in Peru that required a leg 
amputation. And more than one person has been stopped by authorities who are on 
the alert for spies or other nefarious characters. 


Cheers,

Gregg

Gregg Gorton
Philadelphia, PA

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line) 
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Helen Snyder 

Sent: Thursday, July 10, 2014 12:14 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn

 Hi all, I met Bill Gunn in about 1978 when he was part of a CBC crew that came 
to Portal, AZ to do a film on the Chiricahuas. He was the sound man and I 
helped the crew find bird nests to film. It was like getting paid 

$100 a day to be 12 years old and run around in the woods finding every critter 
possible. 




One of my favorite memories of his time here was one day when I was leading the 
crew to a goshawk nest up a steep-sided canyon. Bill was lugging his huge 
expensive reel-to-reel tape recorder that must have been two and a half feet 
wide, and very heavy. He was just behind me when the thin carpet of moss he was 
inching across began to detach from the bedrock below, and Bill and tape 
recorder began to slide off the mountain ever so slowly, heading toward what 
appeared to be an inevitable 50-foot tumble into the gorge below. 




He melodramatically called to me to reach over and take the tape recorder from 
him, in order to save it, never mind him, he was going down with the moss. 
After stabilizing himself with my walking stick he did manage to continue, 
still attached to the tape recorder. For the rest of the week the crew enjoyed 
recounting Bill’s calm and fatalistic Save the Tape Recorder moment. 




He and his wife Lucy bought a winter home here in Portal and Bill died soon 
afterward in 1984 . He also was one of the founders of a Canadian biological 
consulting company called LGL, and the ‘G’ in the name is for Gunn. 
LGL.com’s website has a bit of history on its Home page. 




Helen Snyder

Portal, AZ

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Subject: William W.H. Gunn
From: Helen Snyder <helensnyder AT VTC.NET>
Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2014 09:13:43 -0700
 Hi all, I met Bill Gunn in about 1978 when he was part of a CBC crew that
came to Portal, AZ to do a film on the Chiricahuas. He was the sound man
and I helped the crew find bird nests to film. It was like getting paid
$100 a day to be 12 years old and run around in the woods finding every
critter possible.



One of my favorite memories of his time here was one day when I was leading
the crew to a goshawk nest up a steep-sided canyon. Bill was lugging his
huge expensive reel-to-reel tape recorder that must have been two and a
half feet wide, and very heavy. He was just behind me when the thin carpet
of moss he was inching across began to detach from the bedrock below, and
Bill and tape recorder began to slide off the mountain ever so slowly,
heading toward what appeared to be an inevitable 50-foot tumble into the
gorge below.



He melodramatically called to me to reach over and take the tape recorder
from him, in order to save it, never mind him, he was going down with the
moss. After stabilizing himself with my walking stick he did manage to
continue, still attached to the tape recorder. For the rest of the week the
crew enjoyed recounting Bill’s calm and fatalistic Save the Tape Recorder
moment.



He and his wife Lucy bought a winter home here in Portal and  Bill died
soon afterward in 1984 . He also was one of the founders of a Canadian
biological consulting company called LGL, and the ‘G’ in the name is for
Gunn. LGL.com’s website has a bit of history on its Home page.



Helen Snyder

Portal, AZ

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Subject: Re: William W.H. Gunn
From: MiriamEagl AT AOL.COM
Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2014 07:48:09 -0400
When I was a kid, there WERE no other "young birders"; I was it!  I  was 
very blessed to have Bill and Harriet Davidson take ME under their wings;  
they also happened to be friends with my parents, and they were key in advising 

 my own folks where to take me to find birds in our travels around the 
globe, and even when it came time to have my own SLR camera! (Bill always gave 

me his  cast-off slides, which I thought were magnificent... :-))  Back 
then, you were persecuted for being a birder (as a kid, anyway), so I was very 

grateful  for the adults' friendship and support!
 
 
Mary Beth  Stowe
McAllen, TX
_www.miriameaglemon.com_ (http://www.miriameaglemon.com/) 




In a message dated 7/9/2014 10:57:34 A.M. Central Daylight Time,  
pjw42 AT WAITROSE.COM writes:

There  has been a lot of great stuff in this thread about mentors and
meeting the  greats who were only too happy to give encouragement and
time.

This  will be at a bit of a tangent. I would like to echo what a
privilege it was  for me, on the other side of the pond, to meet, know
and learn from a  number of the greats over here, when I was young. I
largely met them  through meetings, conferences and simply being prepared
to go up and talk  to them, where, with perhaps one exception I can
recall, I always met a  welcome.

This leads me to a concern I have about the sort of  stratification that
seems to come with today's social networking. In  particular I am unclear
about the proliferation of events and movements for  “young birders”. In
my view, young birders should mix with old birders –  both will learn! I
certainly did when young, and to the extent that I do  manage to mix with
young birders today, still do so the other way round. Am  I right,
though, that it happens less today than it used to?

Hope  this makes sense,

Peter
Wheathampstead, Herts,  England

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Subject: Re: Sooty Shearwaters outperform the whales...
From: Richard Carlson <rccarl AT PACBELL.NET>
Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2014 15:59:04 -0700
Loved it! My best experience out there was Dall Porpoise jumping over the back 
of a Humpback whale. Just showing off as the Shearwater flock filled the sky. 


Richard Carlson
Full-time Birder, Biker and Rotarian
Part-time Economist
Tucson, AZ & Lake Tahoe, CA
rccarl AT pacbell.net
Tucson 520-760-4935
Tahoe 530-581-0624
Cell 650-280-2965


>________________________________
> From: Barry K. MacKay 
>To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU 
>Sent: Wednesday, July 9, 2014 10:52 AM
>Subject: [BIRDCHAT] Sooty Shearwaters outperform the whales...
> 
>
>For those of you who, like me, tend, on whale-watching outings, to look over
>the backs of the whales to see the birds:
>
>http://www.grindtv.com/outdoor/nature/post/sooty-shearwaters-steal-spotlight
>-whales/#.U71frBSRino.gmail
>
>Cheers,
>
>Barry
>
>
>
>
>
>Barry Kent MacKay
>
>Bird Artist, Illustrator
>
>Studio: (905)-472-9731
>
>http://www.barrykentmackay.ca
>mimus AT sympatico.ca
>
>Markham, Ontario, Canada
>
>
>
>_,___
>
>
>BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
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>
>
>
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Subject: a book you may want to read
From: Devorah the Ornithologist <birdologist AT GMAIL.COM>
Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2014 21:19:56 +0100
hello everyone,

i published my review of Eric Dinerstein's book, The Kingdom of Rarities.
In this book, he explores the reasons why some species are rare, and he
considers whether rare species play a special role in ecosystem
functioning. Although the book is not exclusively about birds, it is filled
with lots of bird information and stories. but more important, this book
examines a critically important issue that we are confronting more
frequently.

http://gu.com/p/3c52d/tw

cheers,

--
GrrlScientist
Devorah Bennu, PhD
birdologist AT gmail.com
http://twitter.com/GrrlScientist
http://www.theguardian.com/science/grrlscientist

*sunt lacrimae rerum et mentem mortalia tangunt. [*Virgil, *Aeneid*, 1.461
ff.]

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Subject: Sooty Shearwaters outperform the whales...
From: "Barry K. MacKay" <mimus AT SYMPATICO.CA>
Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2014 13:52:53 -0400
For those of you who, like me, tend, on whale-watching outings, to look over
the backs of the whales to see the birds:

http://www.grindtv.com/outdoor/nature/post/sooty-shearwaters-steal-spotlight
-whales/#.U71frBSRino.gmail

 Cheers,

Barry





Barry Kent MacKay

Bird Artist, Illustrator

Studio: (905)-472-9731

http://www.barrykentmackay.ca
mimus AT sympatico.ca

Markham, Ontario, Canada



_,___


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Subject: Re: William W.H. Gunn
From: birding AT AOL.COM
Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2014 12:27:35 -0400
Alvaro,
 
Great story. And to think that "Last of the Curlews" is still going 
strong.........and so is Barry. I miss his birding column in the Toronto Star, 
which sad to say went the way of such columns in other newspapers. Hard to 
believe that there isn't room to continue reporting for such a popular 
activity, but then the writing seems to be on the wall for all print media 
nowadays. Time and "progress" march on. 


All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Alvaro Jaramillo 
To: birding ; BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Wed, Jul 9, 2014 12:23 am
Subject: RE: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn


Ernie

  My friend Bennett (who now leads a bird conservation organization in
Bolivia) and I once pushed Fred Bodsworth's car out of a mud pit he had
landed in. While I knew Fred from my earliest days birding as we were in the
same bird club and he was the nicest of people, I still could not help but
think...wow, I am getting muddy for the author of Last of the Curlews! Well
worth a muddy shoe. 
   As a kid I used to watch a certain Barry Kent MacKay on TV illustrating
wildlife on a kid's show! A few years later I saw my first and only
(still!!) Fieldfare in Toronto found by that same Mr. MacKay - thanks Barry!


Seems like birding was a very connected and small scene a few decades ago.
Everyone seemed to be connected in some way to everyone else. Very different
from today, but this is good....we need more and more birders out there. 

Good birding, 

Alvaro

Alvaro Jaramillo
alvaro AT alvarosadventures.com
www.alvarosadventures.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 7:38 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn

Barry,
 
You were very fortunate to have rubbed shoulders with (and been tutored by)
such illustrious names in Canadian and international birding. 
 
I can say that I travelled on the same tram as Fred Bodsworth (and Pierre
Berton) at Point Pelee, and that I took part in a Baillie Birdathon at Long
Point (when Roger Tory Peterson and Robert Bateman were the guest birders
and speakers), but no real shoulder-rubbing or tutoring. Lucky you! 

On the subject of impressive people, I did bump into Margaret Atwood and
Graeme Gibson (both committed birders) this year at a restaurant near Point
Pelee, and was persuaded by a friend to present her with a copy of my book
on bird song. 
Both very affable and welcoming. Birding sure attracts some amazing people.

All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Barry K. MacKay 
To: birding ; BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Tue, Jul 8, 2014 10:10 pm
Subject: RE: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn


Ah...thank you, Ernie,...that fills in a couple of missing links.   He was
very kind to me, treating me with respect when I was really just a kid with
a passion for birds.   In fact, when I met him, Fred Bodsworth, Don Gunn,
Jim Baillie and a few others, they all were kind and considerate and never
"let on" that they were leaders in the birding community...I learned that
only after they took the time to help me find birds.

Barry


Barry Kent MacKay
Bird Artist, Illustrator
Studio: (905)-472-9731
http://www.barrykentmackay.ca
mimus AT sympatico.ca
Markham, Ontario, Canada


-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM
Sent: July-08-14 7:42 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn

Barry and Chatters,
 
William Gunn actually graduated from the University of Toronto in Commerce
and Finance. After a successful start in business, he then joined the
military, and took part in Exercise Musk-ox, in Canada's north during
1945-46 (where he prepared a report on wildlife).

 After leaving the army, he decided to follow his true love and entered
undergraduate studies in zoology. He was awarded his PHD in 1951. His
subsequent work in recording and research have already been outlined quite
well.

All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com
 


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Subject: Re: William W.H. Gunn
From: Peter Wilkinson <pjw42 AT WAITROSE.COM>
Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2014 16:55:08 +0100
There has been a lot of great stuff in this thread about mentors and
meeting the greats who were only too happy to give encouragement and
time.

This will be at a bit of a tangent. I would like to echo what a
privilege it was for me, on the other side of the pond, to meet, know
and learn from a number of the greats over here, when I was young. I
largely met them through meetings, conferences and simply being prepared
to go up and talk to them, where, with perhaps one exception I can
recall, I always met a welcome.

This leads me to a concern I have about the sort of stratification that
seems to come with today's social networking. In particular I am unclear
about the proliferation of events and movements for “young birders”. In
my view, young birders should mix with old birders – both will learn! I
certainly did when young, and to the extent that I do manage to mix with
young birders today, still do so the other way round. Am I right,
though, that it happens less today than it used to?

Hope this makes sense,

Peter
Wheathampstead, Herts, England

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Subject: Re: Variable skill
From: "Tangren, Gerald Vernon" <tangren AT WSU.EDU>
Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2014 14:55:02 +0000
State of mind can have a lot to do with it; what your mind is prepared for.


Jerry 
WA State University-Tree Fruit Research & Extension Center
Wenatchee, WA
509-663-8181 x 231
USDA Cold Hardiness Zone 7a
http://www.tfrec.wsu.edu/pages/webdev/Favorites



"There are no 'ordinary' people. You have never talked to a mere mortal.
Nations, cultures, arts, civilizations -- these are mortal But it is
immortals whom we joke with, work with, marry, snub and exploit" -- C. S.
Lewis, From The Weight of Glory





On 7/9/14, 6:41 AM, "Al Schirmacher"  wrote:

>Anyone else notice that their audio and/or visual ID skills vary with the
>seasons?
>
>My warbler song skills, in particular, fluctuate - an easy Kentucky
>Warbler or American Redstart in mid-migration takes a bit more work in
>July.
>
>Or a perched Red-shouldered takes a bit of waking up when the previous
>100 were Red-taileds.
>
>Thoughts?
>
>Al Schirmacher
>Muscotah, KS
>
>Sent from my iPhone
>
>BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
>Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
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Subject: Re: William W.H. Gunn
From: "Barry K. MacKay" <mimus AT SYMPATICO.CA>
Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2014 10:25:23 -0400
My own mentors were primarily T.M. Shortt, who I consider to have been the
best bird artist this country ever produced (and especially so in the
difficult medium of scratchboard and pen and ink illustration), and Roger
Tory Peterson, who provided me with exactly the degree of assurance and
psychological support I needed at the time I most needed it, both
understanding what I wanted to achieve with my art.   My main mentors were
Doris and Dr. J. Murray Speirs, but Fred Bodsworth was a dear friend from my
childhood on, and a less assuming individual you could not meet.  I was a
museum brat so totally underfoot with L.L. Snyder, the curator of
ornithology and James L. Baillie, of course...I was frequently a guest in
his and Helen's home, and vice versa.  I came along just a little too late
to have met Cliff Hope, the museum preparatory who died of cancer a short
time before I first stepped foot in the bird room.

The interesting thing about Robert Bateman, that I only recently found out,
is that I went to the same public school (North Preparatory) as he did,
albeit over ten years later.  I had always thought he had gone to West Prep,
but no, he went to North, same as me.

And after he and Bristol Foster made their first trek to Africa (writing
about it for the newspaper as "the Rover Boys", because they drove a Land
Rover) his mother, my mother and I hung what could well have been his first,
certainly one of his first, public exhibits of his art...the studies he did
in Africa, all much different than the work he was to become famous for, and
that was an outdoor exhibit at the opening of the Federation of Ontario
Naturalists (now Ontario Nature) headquarters in Edward's Gardens.   He,
too, was a museum brat ahead of me, and yet, we have never met.

I also should mention that I once met George M. Sutton, introduced by Terry
Shortt.  I was just a kid and remember showing him a sketch I had done of a
Spotted Sandpiper -- face on!   Not a good idea.  He looked at it,
graciously said something like "You don't often see them portrayed that
way," and then wisely advised me to follow the advice of Terry Shortt, which
I would have done anyway.

What I am going to say next I don't want misunderstood, but I found Roger
and Terry to both be, in a way, kind of burdened with a trace of what might
be called melancholy....not something I could easily put my finger on, but
as if they had some regrets for certain of life's turns, and (as, at my
current age, I can well understand...I feel that way myself) how little time
we have to develop and use skills.  Remember I had very long, heart-to-heat
talks with both of them from time to time, and I was sad to think neither of
these fantastically gifted people seemed content in spite of what I saw as
enormous achievement.   I sensed that there was an underlying sense of
discontent that I think may have derived, in part, from wanting recognition
(even Roger, who really was about as famed as anyone in his chosen field
could be).

I originally wanted to follow a career trajectory similar to Terry Shortt's,
as a museum employee artist/illustrator and field ornithologist, but at age
16 a serious illness ended my academic aspirations, and a long, slow
recovery forces me into taking part time work, such as doing that children's
T.V. show Alvaro mentioned.    In the early days it was broadcast live, and
I was on once weekly, but later we would tape three shows in advance.  That
job overlapped a job I got writing a weekly column for The Toronto Star,
which I did for 25 years...originally typing it out on an electric
typewriter and hand-delivering it!

I decided, early on, that I would not go the route of trying to "paint to
market"...that is, do paintings the style and subject of which was dictated
by what was most successfully sold as reproductions.  There is nothing wrong
with that, it just was not what I wanted for myself, and while I have
dabbled a tiny bit in doing "prints" (really mechanical reproductions) I
just have never put my heart into it, preferring more experimental
approaches, and more intimate art featuring the subject (birds almost
always) as opposed to landscapes with birds in them, again there being
nothing wrong with that (I am a huge admirer of much such art...Bateman,
Rungius, Scott, Jaques and others, but Fuertes, Brooks, Eckleberry, Sutton,
Peterson, Weber, Shortt, Thorburn and Reid-Henry were more among my
role-models).

I have to say that if my goal was to avoid producing highly sought after
work worth large amounts of money, I've been spectacularly successful.
But of course I have taken on book illustrating work that paid from time to
time, and some that I just did because I wanted to...such as the just
published The Double-Crested Cormorant: Plight of a Feathered Pariah, by
Linda R. Wires, Yale University Press, 2014, because I read the draft and it
tells brilliantly the truth about this maligned species.   No conflict
here...I made no money and get no royalties, I just want that book out there
and being read.   I do, though, dream of the days when there were elaborate
"state books" beautifully illustrated by artists who did not worry the
distinction between "art" and "illustration" (don't get me started!).

I also wanted to work as an advocate in both environmental and humanitarian
fields.  Unlike many people (most, nearly all???) I don't see them as
mutually exclusive.

That Fieldfare got me into deep trouble.   It showed up at the home of a
couple who were just getting ready to go to Florida, or some such.  The lady
of the house was in very frail health, both physically and emotionally.
They called me up because of the column I wrote and told me that they had a
Fieldfare in their garden in Islington, in greater Toronto.

I was skeptical.   They said they had a sketch they would show me so I drove
over to see.   The sketch was well done, and certainly showed a Fieldfare.
But as a bird artist I know it is possible to sketch a good likeness of a
species in the absence of a model, or by copying a picture....this was not
proof, and the bird was not present.

Still....they had no reason to make things up so I went back the next day,
and there it was!   I had a dilemma...they were very worried about birders
intruding into their garden or disturbing them.   And they didn't want
strangers around while they were away, either.   They begged me not to
reveal their address.

And yet, while I've never been much of a "lister" myself, preferring to see
species in their native habitat, I knew there were many birders who would
want to see that bird.   What to do?   Finally, I wrote about it in my
column, giving the closest major intersection.   Since the Fieldfare only
spent a small part of each day in the mountain ash tree in this particular
garden, I reasoned it must be living off mountain ash berries in the
neighbourhood.

There was a small core of birders who hated me for not giving more specific
directions...and I do mean "hate".   And yet my plan worked, the bird was
soon found, and an old friend of mine, the late J. E. "Red" Mason, took it
upon himself to track the bird, and guide birders to it.

I later did an oil painting of the bird as it was the moment I first saw it.


You can see that painting here:
http://www.oiseaux.net/photos/barry.kent.mackay/grive.litorne.0.html (but
I'm a much better artist now).

Cheers,

Barry


Barry Kent MacKay
Senior Program Associate
Born Free U.S.A.
mimus AT sympatico.ca
Canadian Office:(905) 472-9731
Markham, Ontario, Canada


-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Alvaro Jaramillo
Sent: July-09-14 12:24 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn

Ernie

  My friend Bennett (who now leads a bird conservation organization in
Bolivia) and I once pushed Fred Bodsworth's car out of a mud pit he had
landed in. While I knew Fred from my earliest days birding as we were in the
same bird club and he was the nicest of people, I still could not help but
think...wow, I am getting muddy for the author of Last of the Curlews! Well
worth a muddy shoe.
   As a kid I used to watch a certain Barry Kent MacKay on TV illustrating
wildlife on a kid's show! A few years later I saw my first and only
(still!!) Fieldfare in Toronto found by that same Mr. MacKay - thanks Barry!


Seems like birding was a very connected and small scene a few decades ago.
Everyone seemed to be connected in some way to everyone else. Very different
from today, but this is good....we need more and more birders out there.

Good birding,

Alvaro

Alvaro Jaramillo
alvaro AT alvarosadventures.com
www.alvarosadventures.com


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
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Subject: Variable skill
From: Al Schirmacher <alschirmacher AT LIVE.COM>
Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2014 08:41:42 -0500
Anyone else notice that their audio and/or visual ID skills vary with the 
seasons? 


My warbler song skills, in particular, fluctuate - an easy Kentucky Warbler or 
American Redstart in mid-migration takes a bit more work in July. 


Or a perched Red-shouldered takes a bit of waking up when the previous 100 were 
Red-taileds. 


Thoughts?

Al Schirmacher
Muscotah, KS

Sent from my iPhone

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: William W.H. Gunn
From: Alvaro Jaramillo <chucao AT COASTSIDE.NET>
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 21:23:41 -0700
Ernie

  My friend Bennett (who now leads a bird conservation organization in
Bolivia) and I once pushed Fred Bodsworth's car out of a mud pit he had
landed in. While I knew Fred from my earliest days birding as we were in the
same bird club and he was the nicest of people, I still could not help but
think...wow, I am getting muddy for the author of Last of the Curlews! Well
worth a muddy shoe.
   As a kid I used to watch a certain Barry Kent MacKay on TV illustrating
wildlife on a kid's show! A few years later I saw my first and only
(still!!) Fieldfare in Toronto found by that same Mr. MacKay - thanks Barry!


Seems like birding was a very connected and small scene a few decades ago.
Everyone seemed to be connected in some way to everyone else. Very different
from today, but this is good....we need more and more birders out there.

Good birding,

Alvaro

Alvaro Jaramillo
alvaro AT alvarosadventures.com
www.alvarosadventures.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 7:38 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn

Barry,

You were very fortunate to have rubbed shoulders with (and been tutored by)
such illustrious names in Canadian and international birding.

I can say that I travelled on the same tram as Fred Bodsworth (and Pierre
Berton) at Point Pelee, and that I took part in a Baillie Birdathon at Long
Point (when Roger Tory Peterson and Robert Bateman were the guest birders
and speakers), but no real shoulder-rubbing or tutoring. Lucky you!

On the subject of impressive people, I did bump into Margaret Atwood and
Graeme Gibson (both committed birders) this year at a restaurant near Point
Pelee, and was persuaded by a friend to present her with a copy of my book
on bird song.
Both very affable and welcoming. Birding sure attracts some amazing people.

All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com


-----Original Message-----
From: Barry K. MacKay 
To: birding ; BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Tue, Jul 8, 2014 10:10 pm
Subject: RE: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn


Ah...thank you, Ernie,...that fills in a couple of missing links.   He was
very kind to me, treating me with respect when I was really just a kid with
a passion for birds.   In fact, when I met him, Fred Bodsworth, Don Gunn,
Jim Baillie and a few others, they all were kind and considerate and never
"let on" that they were leaders in the birding community...I learned that
only after they took the time to help me find birds.

Barry


Barry Kent MacKay
Bird Artist, Illustrator
Studio: (905)-472-9731
http://www.barrykentmackay.ca
mimus AT sympatico.ca
Markham, Ontario, Canada


-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM
Sent: July-08-14 7:42 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn

Barry and Chatters,

William Gunn actually graduated from the University of Toronto in Commerce
and Finance. After a successful start in business, he then joined the
military, and took part in Exercise Musk-ox, in Canada's north during
1945-46 (where he prepared a report on wildlife).

 After leaving the army, he decided to follow his true love and entered
undergraduate studies in zoology. He was awarded his PHD in 1951. His
subsequent work in recording and research have already been outlined quite
well.

All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com



BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
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Subject: Re: William W.H. Gunn
From: Alvaro Jaramillo <chucao AT COASTSIDE.NET>
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 21:09:12 -0700
This makes sense! Thanks for clearing it up. I must have known this at some
time and then mixed the two up over the years...it has been some years.

Thanks for the clarification.

Alvaro Jaramillo
alvaro AT alvarosadventures.com
www.alvarosadventures.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Alan Wormington
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 1:41 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn

Alvaro,

You are mixing up two people with the last name of Gunn.

Donald R. Gunn formely lived in Oakville, as you describe.  He is best known
as an excellent photographer.  But William W.H. Gunn (no relation) was based
in Toronto and indeed was an FON Director back in the 1950s.  He also did a
lot of pioneering work at Point Pelee, on reverse migration.  In fact, his
investigations at Point Pelee on reverse migration became his PhD
dissertation (archived at the University of Toronto).

Alan Wormington
Leamington, Ontario




---------- Forwarded Message ----------
From: Alvaro Jaramillo 
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple
finch
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 12:11:46 -0700

Gregg

   Some of Bill Gunn's recordings were released as LPs by the Federation of
Ontario Naturalists. I had a nice collection of these back in the day! You
may contact the FON as they likely have some information or archives on Bill
Gunn. He was their first exectutive director in the 50s. One of the first
Tufted Titmouses I ever studied well was out at his house in Oakville,
Ontario (as I recall), as it was coming to his feeder. I don't recall if he
was still alive, but his wife let birders in to see the goodies when they
showed up.

Good birding,

Alvaro

Alvaro Jaramillo
alvaro AT alvarosadventures.com
www.alvarosadventures.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Gorton, Gregg
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 9:17 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple
finch

Ernie,

You make an excellent point, with which I agree whole-heartedly. Indeed some
of the mnemonics go back to Burroughs and other early nature writers. By
crediting them, we would also preserve memory of their crucial
contributions....  I once had thought to catalog such mnemonics and their
sources, but other activities have prevented that, and now with Apps, etc.,
their value is diminishing somewhat. But if one's auditory memory style is
to use onomatopoeic phrases or other (perhaps descriptive) phrases, they are
still a valuable way to learn and remember...

You mention William W.H. Gunn.  Many are not aware of his very important
work as an early bird recordist.  Do you (Ernie, or anyone else) know how
one might best become acquainted with his life and work?   Googling his name
produces only many of his recordings at the Macaulay Library and lists of
his LP records, but no Wiki listing, or other reference that might flesh him
out, so to speak...   I plan to include him in a paper I am writing on the
history of early Neotropical bird recording, so I would appreciate any
leads....  (Gunn recorded in Venezuela in the late 1950s, with assistance
from another great pioneer bird recordist, Paul Schwartz, but he did little
or  nothing else in the Neotropics. However his recording entitled "A Day at
Flores Moradas" -- a ranch in Venezuela named for purple flowers--was the
very first commercial recording of Neotropical birds ever released, several
years before a series of recordings by Schwartz and early recordings by
Johan Dalgas Frisch!
   in Brazil.

Thanks for any help anyone can provide with regard to Gunn and his work!

Gregg

Gregg Gorton
University of Pennsylvania
Homoaves at gmail.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 11:11 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch

Rick and Chatters,

While many of Peterson's song descriptions are cleverly succinct and quite
informative, as with Neltje Blanchan's purple finch, many of his phonetics
are "picked" from earlier authorities and observers, without any credit
being given. One exception is William Gunn's famous description of the
Canada Warbler's song "Chip, chupety swee-ditchety", which gives credit to
"(Gunn)".

Arthur Cleveland Bent's Life Histories series provides a great number of
phonetics and descriptions for bird songs, that Peterson obviously availed
himself of, for use in his guides. It seems that no one ever objected to
this use of sources, without credit being given, whether it be the original
authors (if still alive), family members or publishers, or for that matter,
anyone in the birding community. Even if, as a government publication, the
Bent series was in the public domain, would it not be a courtesy to
acknowledge a source (as he did in the case of William Gunn)?

All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com




-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Wright 
To: BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Sat, Jul 5, 2014 8:58 am
Subject: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch


Now there's a name you don't see nowadays. I've written a brief note about
her most memorable -- and utterly unknown -- contribution to Roger Tory
Peterson's first field guide at http://birdingnewjersey.com .

--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey  ABA Field Guide to Birds of
New Jersey


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Subject: Re: William W.H. Gunn
From: birding AT AOL.COM
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 22:38:28 -0400
Barry,
 
You were very fortunate to have rubbed shoulders with (and been tutored by) 
such 

illustrious names in Canadian and international birding. 
 
I can say that I travelled on the same tram as Fred Bodsworth (and Pierre 
Berton) at Point Pelee, 

and that I took part in a Baillie Birdathon at Long Point (when Roger Tory 
Peterson and Robert Bateman were the guest birders and speakers), but no real 
shoulder-rubbing or tutoring. Lucky you! 

On the subject of impressive people, I did bump into Margaret Atwood and Graeme 

Gibson (both committed birders) this year at a restaurant near Point Pelee, and 

was persuaded by a friend to present her with a copy of my book on bird song. 
Both very affable and welcoming. Birding sure attracts some amazing people.

All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Barry K. MacKay 
To: birding ; BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Tue, Jul 8, 2014 10:10 pm
Subject: RE: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn


Ah...thank you, Ernie,...that fills in a couple of missing links.   He was
very kind to me, treating me with respect when I was really just a kid with
a passion for birds.   In fact, when I met him, Fred Bodsworth, Don Gunn,
Jim Baillie and a few others, they all were kind and considerate and never
"let on" that they were leaders in the birding community...I learned that
only after they took the time to help me find birds.

Barry


Barry Kent MacKay
Bird Artist, Illustrator
Studio: (905)-472-9731
http://www.barrykentmackay.ca
mimus AT sympatico.ca
Markham, Ontario, Canada


-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM
Sent: July-08-14 7:42 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn

Barry and Chatters,
 
William Gunn actually graduated from the University of Toronto in Commerce
and Finance. After a successful start in business, he then joined the
military, and took part in Exercise Musk-ox, in Canada's north during
1945-46 (where he prepared a report on wildlife).

 After leaving the army, he decided to follow his true love and entered
undergraduate studies in zoology. He was awarded his PHD in 1951. His
subsequent work in recording and research have already been outlined quite
well.

All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com
 


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: William W.H. Gunn
From: "Barry K. MacKay" <mimus AT SYMPATICO.CA>
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 22:10:19 -0400
Ah...thank you, Ernie,...that fills in a couple of missing links.   He was
very kind to me, treating me with respect when I was really just a kid with
a passion for birds.   In fact, when I met him, Fred Bodsworth, Don Gunn,
Jim Baillie and a few others, they all were kind and considerate and never
"let on" that they were leaders in the birding community...I learned that
only after they took the time to help me find birds.

Barry


Barry Kent MacKay
Bird Artist, Illustrator
Studio: (905)-472-9731
http://www.barrykentmackay.ca
mimus AT sympatico.ca
Markham, Ontario, Canada


-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM
Sent: July-08-14 7:42 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn

Barry and Chatters,

William Gunn actually graduated from the University of Toronto in Commerce
and Finance. After a successful start in business, he then joined the
military, and took part in Exercise Musk-ox, in Canada's north during
1945-46 (where he prepared a report on wildlife).

 After leaving the army, he decided to follow his true love and entered
undergraduate studies in zoology. He was awarded his PHD in 1951. His
subsequent work in recording and research have already been outlined quite
well.

All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com


-----Original Message-----
From: Barry K. MacKay 
To: BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Tue, Jul 8, 2014 5:27 pm
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn


Agreed.

Don Gunn always welcomed birders in to see his set up in Oakville, and once
laid out seed in the words (as I recall) "merry Christmas", and then, when a
swarm of Mourning Doves descended (this before they commonly wintered in
Ontario) photographed the words spelled out in living Mourning Doves and
used that photograph as his Christmas card...very clever.

Both were known as "Dr. Gunn", Don Gunn being a medical doctor, Bill Gunn
having, as I recall, an honorary degree (but I could be wrong...he was
certainly bright and well educated) and I think was involved during or after
the war in some military project called "Project Muskox" or some such...may
have had to do with the dew line...but although I knew them both, that was
all a long time ago, now; memories soften and fade.

But I recall so very well that in his recordings WWH Gunn did not shy away
from ambient noise and his recording of an American Robin singing was all
the more evocative for having the sound of someone shoveling late winter
snow, in the background.   His recording of A Day in Algonquin Park included
the paddling of a canoe...you could close your eyes and you were THERE, as
the sound slowly gave way to the calling of bull frogs, and then, most
wonderful and evocative of all, the wondrous serenading of loons.


Barry


Barry Kent MacKay
Bird Artist, Illustrator
Studio: (905)-472-9731
http://www.barrykentmackay.ca
mimus AT sympatico.ca
Markham, Ontario, Canada


WWH Gunn

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Alan Wormington
Sent: July-08-14 4:41 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn

Alvaro,

You are mixing up two people with the last name of Gunn.

Donald R. Gunn formely lived in Oakville, as you describe.  He is best known
as an excellent photographer.  But William W.H. Gunn (no relation) was based
in Toronto and indeed was an FON Director back in the 1950s.  He also did a
lot of pioneering work at Point Pelee, on reverse migration.  In fact, his
investigations at Point Pelee on reverse migration became his PhD
dissertation (archived at the University of Toronto).

Alan Wormington
Leamington, Ontario




---------- Forwarded Message ----------
From: Alvaro Jaramillo 
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple
finch
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 12:11:46 -0700

Gregg

   Some of Bill Gunn's recordings were released as LPs by the Federation of
Ontario Naturalists. I had a nice collection of these back in the day! You
may contact the FON as they likely have some information or archives on Bill
Gunn. He was their first exectutive director in the 50s. One of the first
Tufted Titmouses I ever studied well was out at his house in Oakville,
Ontario (as I recall), as it was coming to his feeder. I don't recall if he
was still alive, but his wife let birders in to see the goodies when they
showed up.

Good birding,

Alvaro

Alvaro Jaramillo
alvaro AT alvarosadventures.com
www.alvarosadventures.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Gorton, Gregg
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 9:17 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple
finch

Ernie,

You make an excellent point, with which I agree whole-heartedly. Indeed some
of the mnemonics go back to Burroughs and other early nature writers. By
crediting them, we would also preserve memory of their crucial
contributions....  I once had thought to catalog such mnemonics and their
sources, but other activities have prevented that, and now with Apps, etc.,
their value is diminishing somewhat. But if one's auditory memory style is
to use onomatopoeic phrases or other (perhaps descriptive) phrases, they are
still a valuable way to learn and remember...

You mention William W.H. Gunn.  Many are not aware of his very important
work as an early bird recordist.  Do you (Ernie, or anyone else) know how
one might best become acquainted with his life and work?   Googling his name
produces only many of his recordings at the Macaulay Library and lists of
his LP records, but no Wiki listing, or other reference that might flesh him
out, so to speak...   I plan to include him in a paper I am writing on the
history of early Neotropical bird recording, so I would appreciate any
leads....  (Gunn recorded in Venezuela in the late 1950s, with assistance
from another great pioneer bird recordist, Paul Schwartz, but he did little
or  nothing else in the Neotropics. However his recording entitled "A Day at
Flores Moradas" -- a ranch in Venezuela named for purple flowers--was the
very first commercial recording of Neotropical birds ever released, several
years before a series of recordings by Schwartz and early recordings by
Johan Dalgas Frisch!
   in Brazil.

Thanks for any help anyone can provide with regard to Gunn and his work!

Gregg

Gregg Gorton
University of Pennsylvania
Homoaves at gmail.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 11:11 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch

Rick and Chatters,

While many of Peterson's song descriptions are cleverly succinct and quite
informative, as with Neltje Blanchan's purple finch, many of his phonetics
are "picked" from earlier authorities and observers, without any credit
being given. One exception is William Gunn's famous description of the
Canada Warbler's song "Chip, chupety swee-ditchety", which gives credit to
"(Gunn)".

Arthur Cleveland Bent's Life Histories series provides a great number of
phonetics and descriptions for bird songs, that Peterson obviously availed
himself of, for use in his guides. It seems that no one ever objected to
this use of sources, without credit being given, whether it be the original
authors (if still alive), family members or publishers, or for that matter,
anyone in the birding community. Even if, as a government publication, the
Bent series was in the public domain, would it not be a courtesy to
acknowledge a source (as he did in the case of William Gunn)?

All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com




-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Wright 
To: BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Sat, Jul 5, 2014 8:58 am
Subject: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch


Now there's a name you don't see nowadays. I've written a brief note about
her most memorable -- and utterly unknown -- contribution to Roger Tory
Peterson's first field guide at http://birdingnewjersey.com .

--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey  ABA Field Guide to Birds of
New Jersey


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html



BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html



BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: William W.H. Gunn
From: birding AT AOL.COM
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 19:41:40 -0400
Barry and Chatters,
 
William Gunn actually graduated from the University of Toronto in Commerce and 
Finance. After a successful start in business, he then joined the military, and 
took part in Exercise Musk-ox, in Canada's north during 1945-46 (where he 
prepared a report on wildlife). 


 After leaving the army, he decided to follow his true love and entered 
undergraduate studies in zoology. He was awarded his PHD in 1951. His 
subsequent work in recording and research have already been outlined quite 
well. 


All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Barry K. MacKay 
To: BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Tue, Jul 8, 2014 5:27 pm
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn


Agreed.

Don Gunn always welcomed birders in to see his set up in Oakville, and once
laid out seed in the words (as I recall) "merry Christmas", and then, when a
swarm of Mourning Doves descended (this before they commonly wintered in
Ontario) photographed the words spelled out in living Mourning Doves and
used that photograph as his Christmas card...very clever.

Both were known as "Dr. Gunn", Don Gunn being a medical doctor, Bill Gunn
having, as I recall, an honorary degree (but I could be wrong...he was
certainly bright and well educated) and I think was involved during or after
the war in some military project called "Project Muskox" or some such...may
have had to do with the dew line...but although I knew them both, that was
all a long time ago, now; memories soften and fade.

But I recall so very well that in his recordings WWH Gunn did not shy away
from ambient noise and his recording of an American Robin singing was all
the more evocative for having the sound of someone shoveling late winter
snow, in the background.   His recording of A Day in Algonquin Park included
the paddling of a canoe...you could close your eyes and you were THERE, as
the sound slowly gave way to the calling of bull frogs, and then, most
wonderful and evocative of all, the wondrous serenading of loons.


Barry


Barry Kent MacKay
Bird Artist, Illustrator
Studio: (905)-472-9731
http://www.barrykentmackay.ca
mimus AT sympatico.ca
Markham, Ontario, Canada


WWH Gunn

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Alan Wormington
Sent: July-08-14 4:41 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn

Alvaro,

You are mixing up two people with the last name of Gunn.

Donald R. Gunn formely lived in Oakville, as you describe.  He is best known
as an excellent photographer.  But William W.H. Gunn (no relation) was based
in Toronto and indeed was an FON Director back in the 1950s.  He also did a
lot of pioneering work at Point Pelee, on reverse migration.  In fact, his
investigations at Point Pelee on reverse migration became his PhD
dissertation (archived at the University of Toronto).

Alan Wormington
Leamington, Ontario




---------- Forwarded Message ----------
From: Alvaro Jaramillo 
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple
finch
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 12:11:46 -0700

Gregg

   Some of Bill Gunn's recordings were released as LPs by the Federation of
Ontario Naturalists. I had a nice collection of these back in the day! You
may contact the FON as they likely have some information or archives on Bill
Gunn. He was their first exectutive director in the 50s. One of the first
Tufted Titmouses I ever studied well was out at his house in Oakville,
Ontario (as I recall), as it was coming to his feeder. I don't recall if he
was still alive, but his wife let birders in to see the goodies when they
showed up.

Good birding,

Alvaro

Alvaro Jaramillo
alvaro AT alvarosadventures.com
www.alvarosadventures.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Gorton, Gregg
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 9:17 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple
finch

Ernie,

You make an excellent point, with which I agree whole-heartedly. Indeed some
of the mnemonics go back to Burroughs and other early nature writers. By
crediting them, we would also preserve memory of their crucial
contributions....  I once had thought to catalog such mnemonics and their
sources, but other activities have prevented that, and now with Apps, etc.,
their value is diminishing somewhat. But if one's auditory memory style is
to use onomatopoeic phrases or other (perhaps descriptive) phrases, they are
still a valuable way to learn and remember...

You mention William W.H. Gunn.  Many are not aware of his very important
work as an early bird recordist.  Do you (Ernie, or anyone else) know how
one might best become acquainted with his life and work?   Googling his name
produces only many of his recordings at the Macaulay Library and lists of
his LP records, but no Wiki listing, or other reference that might flesh him
out, so to speak...   I plan to include him in a paper I am writing on the
history of early Neotropical bird recording, so I would appreciate any
leads....  (Gunn recorded in Venezuela in the late 1950s, with assistance
from another great pioneer bird recordist, Paul Schwartz, but he did little
or  nothing else in the Neotropics. However his recording entitled "A Day at
Flores Moradas" -- a ranch in Venezuela named for purple flowers--was the
very first commercial recording of Neotropical birds ever released, several
years before a series of recordings by Schwartz and early recordings by
Johan Dalgas Frisch!
   in Brazil.

Thanks for any help anyone can provide with regard to Gunn and his work!

Gregg

Gregg Gorton
University of Pennsylvania
Homoaves at gmail.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 11:11 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch

Rick and Chatters,

While many of Peterson's song descriptions are cleverly succinct and quite
informative, as with Neltje Blanchan's purple finch, many of his phonetics
are "picked" from earlier authorities and observers, without any credit
being given. One exception is William Gunn's famous description of the
Canada Warbler's song "Chip, chupety swee-ditchety", which gives credit to
"(Gunn)".

Arthur Cleveland Bent's Life Histories series provides a great number of
phonetics and descriptions for bird songs, that Peterson obviously availed
himself of, for use in his guides. It seems that no one ever objected to
this use of sources, without credit being given, whether it be the original
authors (if still alive), family members or publishers, or for that matter,
anyone in the birding community. Even if, as a government publication, the
Bent series was in the public domain, would it not be a courtesy to
acknowledge a source (as he did in the case of William Gunn)?

All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com




-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Wright 
To: BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Sat, Jul 5, 2014 8:58 am
Subject: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch


Now there's a name you don't see nowadays. I've written a brief note about
her most memorable -- and utterly unknown -- contribution to Roger Tory
Peterson's first field guide at http://birdingnewjersey.com .

--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey  ABA Field Guide to Birds of
New Jersey


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html



BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

 

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn
From: "Gorton, Gregg" <Gregg.Gorton AT VA.GOV>
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 17:47:27 -0400
Thanks to everyone who took the time so thoughtfully to respond to my request 
for information about Bill Gunn. I will be pursuing some of the leads I was 
given, and once the article on early bird recording in the Neotropics is 
published, I will alert the list. --And, hey, maybe someone will consider 
writing the early history of Nearctic recording--because though I will start my 
piece with Arthur Allen and PP Kellogg, and Irby Davis and Ben/Lula Coffey, and 
Bud Lanyon, the trail that I will pursue thereafter will veer directly 
southward to tropical Mexico, Central America, and South America. 


Good Birding,

Gregg


Gregg Gorton
Philadelphia, PA

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line) 
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Barry K. MacKay 

Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 5:26 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn

Agreed.

Don Gunn always welcomed birders in to see his set up in Oakville, and once 
laid out seed in the words (as I recall) "merry Christmas", and then, when a 
swarm of Mourning Doves descended (this before they commonly wintered in 

Ontario) photographed the words spelled out in living Mourning Doves and used 
that photograph as his Christmas card...very clever. 


Both were known as "Dr. Gunn", Don Gunn being a medical doctor, Bill Gunn 
having, as I recall, an honorary degree (but I could be wrong...he was 
certainly bright and well educated) and I think was involved during or after 
the war in some military project called "Project Muskox" or some such...may 
have had to do with the dew line...but although I knew them both, that was all 
a long time ago, now; memories soften and fade. 


But I recall so very well that in his recordings WWH Gunn did not shy away from 
ambient noise and his recording of an American Robin singing was all the more 
evocative for having the sound of someone shoveling late winter 

snow, in the background.   His recording of A Day in Algonquin Park included
the paddling of a canoe...you could close your eyes and you were THERE, as the 
sound slowly gave way to the calling of bull frogs, and then, most wonderful 
and evocative of all, the wondrous serenading of loons. 



Barry


Barry Kent MacKay
Bird Artist, Illustrator
Studio: (905)-472-9731
http://www.barrykentmackay.ca
mimus AT sympatico.ca
Markham, Ontario, Canada


WWH Gunn

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line) 
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Alan Wormington 

Sent: July-08-14 4:41 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn

Alvaro,

You are mixing up two people with the last name of Gunn.

Donald R. Gunn formely lived in Oakville, as you describe. He is best known as 
an excellent photographer. But William W.H. Gunn (no relation) was based in 
Toronto and indeed was an FON Director back in the 1950s. He also did a lot of 
pioneering work at Point Pelee, on reverse migration. In fact, his 
investigations at Point Pelee on reverse migration became his PhD dissertation 
(archived at the University of Toronto). 


Alan Wormington
Leamington, Ontario




---------- Forwarded Message ----------
From: Alvaro Jaramillo 
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple 
finch 

Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 12:11:46 -0700

Gregg

 Some of Bill Gunn's recordings were released as LPs by the Federation of 
Ontario Naturalists. I had a nice collection of these back in the day! You may 
contact the FON as they likely have some information or archives on Bill Gunn. 
He was their first exectutive director in the 50s. One of the first Tufted 
Titmouses I ever studied well was out at his house in Oakville, Ontario (as I 
recall), as it was coming to his feeder. I don't recall if he was still alive, 
but his wife let birders in to see the goodies when they showed up. 


Good birding,

Alvaro

Alvaro Jaramillo
alvaro AT alvarosadventures.com
www.alvarosadventures.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line) 
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Gorton, Gregg 

Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 9:17 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple 
finch 


Ernie,

You make an excellent point, with which I agree whole-heartedly. Indeed some of 
the mnemonics go back to Burroughs and other early nature writers. By crediting 
them, we would also preserve memory of their crucial contributions.... I once 
had thought to catalog such mnemonics and their sources, but other activities 
have prevented that, and now with Apps, etc., their value is diminishing 
somewhat. But if one's auditory memory style is to use onomatopoeic phrases or 
other (perhaps descriptive) phrases, they are still a valuable way to learn and 
remember... 


You mention William W.H. Gunn. Many are not aware of his very important work as 
an early bird recordist. Do you (Ernie, or anyone else) know how 

one might best become acquainted with his life and work?   Googling his name
produces only many of his recordings at the Macaulay Library and lists of his 
LP records, but no Wiki listing, or other reference that might flesh him 

out, so to speak...   I plan to include him in a paper I am writing on the
history of early Neotropical bird recording, so I would appreciate any 
leads.... (Gunn recorded in Venezuela in the late 1950s, with assistance from 
another great pioneer bird recordist, Paul Schwartz, but he did little or 
nothing else in the Neotropics. However his recording entitled "A Day at Flores 
Moradas" -- a ranch in Venezuela named for purple flowers--was the very first 
commercial recording of Neotropical birds ever released, several years before a 
series of recordings by Schwartz and early recordings by Johan Dalgas Frisch! 

   in Brazil.

Thanks for any help anyone can provide with regard to Gunn and his work!

Gregg

Gregg Gorton
University of Pennsylvania
Homoaves at gmail.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line) 
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM 

Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 11:11 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch

Rick and Chatters,

While many of Peterson's song descriptions are cleverly succinct and quite 
informative, as with Neltje Blanchan's purple finch, many of his phonetics are 
"picked" from earlier authorities and observers, without any credit being 
given. One exception is William Gunn's famous description of the Canada 
Warbler's song "Chip, chupety swee-ditchety", which gives credit to "(Gunn)". 


Arthur Cleveland Bent's Life Histories series provides a great number of 
phonetics and descriptions for bird songs, that Peterson obviously availed 
himself of, for use in his guides. It seems that no one ever objected to this 
use of sources, without credit being given, whether it be the original authors 
(if still alive), family members or publishers, or for that matter, anyone in 
the birding community. Even if, as a government publication, the Bent series 
was in the public domain, would it not be a courtesy to acknowledge a source 
(as he did in the case of William Gunn)? 


All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com




-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Wright 
To: BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Sat, Jul 5, 2014 8:58 am
Subject: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch


Now there's a name you don't see nowadays. I've written a brief note about her 
most memorable -- and utterly unknown -- contribution to Roger Tory Peterson's 
first field guide at http://birdingnewjersey.com . 


--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey  ABA Field Guide to Birds of 
New Jersey 



BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html



BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: William W.H. Gunn
From: "Barry K. MacKay" <mimus AT SYMPATICO.CA>
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 17:25:31 -0400
Agreed.

Don Gunn always welcomed birders in to see his set up in Oakville, and once
laid out seed in the words (as I recall) "merry Christmas", and then, when a
swarm of Mourning Doves descended (this before they commonly wintered in
Ontario) photographed the words spelled out in living Mourning Doves and
used that photograph as his Christmas card...very clever.

Both were known as "Dr. Gunn", Don Gunn being a medical doctor, Bill Gunn
having, as I recall, an honorary degree (but I could be wrong...he was
certainly bright and well educated) and I think was involved during or after
the war in some military project called "Project Muskox" or some such...may
have had to do with the dew line...but although I knew them both, that was
all a long time ago, now; memories soften and fade.

But I recall so very well that in his recordings WWH Gunn did not shy away
from ambient noise and his recording of an American Robin singing was all
the more evocative for having the sound of someone shoveling late winter
snow, in the background.   His recording of A Day in Algonquin Park included
the paddling of a canoe...you could close your eyes and you were THERE, as
the sound slowly gave way to the calling of bull frogs, and then, most
wonderful and evocative of all, the wondrous serenading of loons.


Barry


Barry Kent MacKay
Bird Artist, Illustrator
Studio: (905)-472-9731
http://www.barrykentmackay.ca
mimus AT sympatico.ca
Markham, Ontario, Canada


WWH Gunn

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Alan Wormington
Sent: July-08-14 4:41 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] William W.H. Gunn

Alvaro,

You are mixing up two people with the last name of Gunn.

Donald R. Gunn formely lived in Oakville, as you describe.  He is best known
as an excellent photographer.  But William W.H. Gunn (no relation) was based
in Toronto and indeed was an FON Director back in the 1950s.  He also did a
lot of pioneering work at Point Pelee, on reverse migration.  In fact, his
investigations at Point Pelee on reverse migration became his PhD
dissertation (archived at the University of Toronto).

Alan Wormington
Leamington, Ontario




---------- Forwarded Message ----------
From: Alvaro Jaramillo 
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple
finch
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 12:11:46 -0700

Gregg

   Some of Bill Gunn's recordings were released as LPs by the Federation of
Ontario Naturalists. I had a nice collection of these back in the day! You
may contact the FON as they likely have some information or archives on Bill
Gunn. He was their first exectutive director in the 50s. One of the first
Tufted Titmouses I ever studied well was out at his house in Oakville,
Ontario (as I recall), as it was coming to his feeder. I don't recall if he
was still alive, but his wife let birders in to see the goodies when they
showed up.

Good birding,

Alvaro

Alvaro Jaramillo
alvaro AT alvarosadventures.com
www.alvarosadventures.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Gorton, Gregg
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 9:17 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple
finch

Ernie,

You make an excellent point, with which I agree whole-heartedly. Indeed some
of the mnemonics go back to Burroughs and other early nature writers. By
crediting them, we would also preserve memory of their crucial
contributions....  I once had thought to catalog such mnemonics and their
sources, but other activities have prevented that, and now with Apps, etc.,
their value is diminishing somewhat. But if one's auditory memory style is
to use onomatopoeic phrases or other (perhaps descriptive) phrases, they are
still a valuable way to learn and remember...

You mention William W.H. Gunn.  Many are not aware of his very important
work as an early bird recordist.  Do you (Ernie, or anyone else) know how
one might best become acquainted with his life and work?   Googling his name
produces only many of his recordings at the Macaulay Library and lists of
his LP records, but no Wiki listing, or other reference that might flesh him
out, so to speak...   I plan to include him in a paper I am writing on the
history of early Neotropical bird recording, so I would appreciate any
leads....  (Gunn recorded in Venezuela in the late 1950s, with assistance
from another great pioneer bird recordist, Paul Schwartz, but he did little
or  nothing else in the Neotropics. However his recording entitled "A Day at
Flores Moradas" -- a ranch in Venezuela named for purple flowers--was the
very first commercial recording of Neotropical birds ever released, several
years before a series of recordings by Schwartz and early recordings by
Johan Dalgas Frisch!
   in Brazil.

Thanks for any help anyone can provide with regard to Gunn and his work!

Gregg

Gregg Gorton
University of Pennsylvania
Homoaves at gmail.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 11:11 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch

Rick and Chatters,

While many of Peterson's song descriptions are cleverly succinct and quite
informative, as with Neltje Blanchan's purple finch, many of his phonetics
are "picked" from earlier authorities and observers, without any credit
being given. One exception is William Gunn's famous description of the
Canada Warbler's song "Chip, chupety swee-ditchety", which gives credit to
"(Gunn)".

Arthur Cleveland Bent's Life Histories series provides a great number of
phonetics and descriptions for bird songs, that Peterson obviously availed
himself of, for use in his guides. It seems that no one ever objected to
this use of sources, without credit being given, whether it be the original
authors (if still alive), family members or publishers, or for that matter,
anyone in the birding community. Even if, as a government publication, the
Bent series was in the public domain, would it not be a courtesy to
acknowledge a source (as he did in the case of William Gunn)?

All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com




-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Wright 
To: BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Sat, Jul 5, 2014 8:58 am
Subject: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch


Now there's a name you don't see nowadays. I've written a brief note about
her most memorable -- and utterly unknown -- contribution to Roger Tory
Peterson's first field guide at http://birdingnewjersey.com .

--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey  ABA Field Guide to Birds of
New Jersey


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html



BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: William W.H. Gunn
From: Alan Wormington <wormington AT JUNO.COM>
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 20:40:44 +0000
Alvaro,

You are mixing up two people with the last name of Gunn.

Donald R. Gunn formely lived in Oakville, as you describe. He is best known as 
an excellent photographer. But William W.H. Gunn (no relation) was based in 
Toronto and indeed was an FON Director back in the 1950s. He also did a lot of 
pioneering work at Point Pelee, on reverse migration. In fact, his 
investigations at Point Pelee on reverse migration became his PhD dissertation 
(archived at the University of Toronto). 


Alan Wormington
Leamington, Ontario




---------- Forwarded Message ----------
From: Alvaro Jaramillo 
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple 
finch 

Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 12:11:46 -0700

Gregg

   Some of Bill Gunn's recordings were released as LPs by the Federation of
Ontario Naturalists. I had a nice collection of these back in the day! You
may contact the FON as they likely have some information or archives on Bill
Gunn. He was their first exectutive director in the 50s. One of the first
Tufted Titmouses I ever studied well was out at his house in Oakville,
Ontario (as I recall), as it was coming to his feeder. I don't recall if he
was still alive, but his wife let birders in to see the goodies when they
showed up.

Good birding,

Alvaro

Alvaro Jaramillo
alvaro AT alvarosadventures.com
www.alvarosadventures.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Gorton, Gregg
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 9:17 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple
finch

Ernie,

You make an excellent point, with which I agree whole-heartedly. Indeed some
of the mnemonics go back to Burroughs and other early nature writers. By
crediting them, we would also preserve memory of their crucial
contributions....  I once had thought to catalog such mnemonics and their
sources, but other activities have prevented that, and now with Apps, etc.,
their value is diminishing somewhat. But if one's auditory memory style is
to use onomatopoeic phrases or other (perhaps descriptive) phrases, they are
still a valuable way to learn and remember...

You mention William W.H. Gunn.  Many are not aware of his very important
work as an early bird recordist.  Do you (Ernie, or anyone else) know how
one might best become acquainted with his life and work?   Googling his name
produces only many of his recordings at the Macaulay Library and lists of
his LP records, but no Wiki listing, or other reference that might flesh him
out, so to speak...   I plan to include him in a paper I am writing on the
history of early Neotropical bird recording, so I would appreciate any
leads....  (Gunn recorded in Venezuela in the late 1950s, with assistance
from another great pioneer bird recordist, Paul Schwartz, but he did little
or  nothing else in the Neotropics. However his recording entitled "A Day at
Flores Moradas" -- a ranch in Venezuela named for purple flowers--was the
very first commercial recording of Neotropical birds ever released, several
years before a series of recordings by Schwartz and early recordings by
Johan Dalgas Frisch!
   in Brazil.

Thanks for any help anyone can provide with regard to Gunn and his work!

Gregg

Gregg Gorton
University of Pennsylvania
Homoaves at gmail.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 11:11 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch

Rick and Chatters,

While many of Peterson's song descriptions are cleverly succinct and quite
informative, as with Neltje Blanchan's purple finch, many of his phonetics
are "picked" from earlier authorities and observers, without any credit
being given. One exception is William Gunn's famous description of the
Canada Warbler's song "Chip, chupety swee-ditchety", which gives credit to
"(Gunn)".

Arthur Cleveland Bent's Life Histories series provides a great number of
phonetics and descriptions for bird songs, that Peterson obviously availed
himself of, for use in his guides. It seems that no one ever objected to
this use of sources, without credit being given, whether it be the original
authors (if still alive), family members or publishers, or for that matter,
anyone in the birding community. Even if, as a government publication, the
Bent series was in the public domain, would it not be a courtesy to
acknowledge a source (as he did in the case of William Gunn)?

All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com




-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Wright 
To: BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Sat, Jul 5, 2014 8:58 am
Subject: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch


Now there's a name you don't see nowadays. I've written a brief note about
her most memorable -- and utterly unknown -- contribution to Roger Tory
Peterson's first field guide at http://birdingnewjersey.com .

--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey  ABA Field Guide to Birds of
New Jersey


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html



BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch
From: Alvaro Jaramillo <chucao AT COASTSIDE.NET>
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 12:11:46 -0700
Gregg

   Some of Bill Gunn's recordings were released as LPs by the Federation of
Ontario Naturalists. I had a nice collection of these back in the day! You
may contact the FON as they likely have some information or archives on Bill
Gunn. He was their first exectutive director in the 50s. One of the first
Tufted Titmouses I ever studied well was out at his house in Oakville,
Ontario (as I recall), as it was coming to his feeder. I don't recall if he
was still alive, but his wife let birders in to see the goodies when they
showed up.

Good birding,

Alvaro

Alvaro Jaramillo
alvaro AT alvarosadventures.com
www.alvarosadventures.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Gorton, Gregg
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 9:17 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple
finch

Ernie,

You make an excellent point, with which I agree whole-heartedly. Indeed some
of the mnemonics go back to Burroughs and other early nature writers. By
crediting them, we would also preserve memory of their crucial
contributions....  I once had thought to catalog such mnemonics and their
sources, but other activities have prevented that, and now with Apps, etc.,
their value is diminishing somewhat. But if one's auditory memory style is
to use onomatopoeic phrases or other (perhaps descriptive) phrases, they are
still a valuable way to learn and remember...

You mention William W.H. Gunn.  Many are not aware of his very important
work as an early bird recordist.  Do you (Ernie, or anyone else) know how
one might best become acquainted with his life and work?   Googling his name
produces only many of his recordings at the Macaulay Library and lists of
his LP records, but no Wiki listing, or other reference that might flesh him
out, so to speak...   I plan to include him in a paper I am writing on the
history of early Neotropical bird recording, so I would appreciate any
leads....  (Gunn recorded in Venezuela in the late 1950s, with assistance
from another great pioneer bird recordist, Paul Schwartz, but he did little
or  nothing else in the Neotropics. However his recording entitled "A Day at
Flores Moradas" -- a ranch in Venezuela named for purple flowers--was the
very first commercial recording of Neotropical birds ever released, several
years before a series of recordings by Schwartz and early recordings by
Johan Dalgas Frisch!
   in Brazil.

Thanks for any help anyone can provide with regard to Gunn and his work!

Gregg

Gregg Gorton
University of Pennsylvania
Homoaves at gmail.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 11:11 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch

Rick and Chatters,

While many of Peterson's song descriptions are cleverly succinct and quite
informative, as with Neltje Blanchan's purple finch, many of his phonetics
are "picked" from earlier authorities and observers, without any credit
being given. One exception is William Gunn's famous description of the
Canada Warbler's song "Chip, chupety swee-ditchety", which gives credit to
"(Gunn)".

Arthur Cleveland Bent's Life Histories series provides a great number of
phonetics and descriptions for bird songs, that Peterson obviously availed
himself of, for use in his guides. It seems that no one ever objected to
this use of sources, without credit being given, whether it be the original
authors (if still alive), family members or publishers, or for that matter,
anyone in the birding community. Even if, as a government publication, the
Bent series was in the public domain, would it not be a courtesy to
acknowledge a source (as he did in the case of William Gunn)?

All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com




-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Wright 
To: BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Sat, Jul 5, 2014 8:58 am
Subject: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch


Now there's a name you don't see nowadays. I've written a brief note about
her most memorable -- and utterly unknown -- contribution to Roger Tory
Peterson's first field guide at http://birdingnewjersey.com .

--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey  ABA Field Guide to Birds of
New Jersey


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html



BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: Neltje Blanchan's purple finch
From: birding AT AOL.COM
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 14:22:05 -0400
David and Chatters,
 
 I understand your point here, but I think there is enough consensus, or even 
proof, in some cases that make an acknowledgement seem reasonable. Why bother 
even mentioning Gunn, if that's not the case? I do know that there are other 
versions with some similarities to Gunn's, but his is unique does seem to hit 
the mark. 


To back up what you are saying, Peterson's description of the Savannah 
Sparrow's song "tsit-tsit-tsit, tseeee-tsaaay", seems like it could be a 
combination of A. A. Saunders' (1935) and Ralph Hoffman's (1904). The basic 
presentation in each, forms the core of Peterson's version. 


I think it is worth noting that there were far fewer individuals interested in 
"coining phrases" for bird song in the early days than there would be today, so 
that would help some, in trying to track down a source. But I also realize that 
many were not publishing their every thought, as is the case nowadays, and an 
author could easily include someone else's ideas (coined phrases or 
descriptions) in their published work. 


If Bent was considered as being part of the public domain, then this particular 
discussion is based on a moot point; otherwise, we don't want to wander too far 
from acknowledging sources where this IS possible. 


As an afterthought, I wonder who created "Cock-a-doodle-doo" .............and 
who they stole it from? 


All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com
 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Spector, David (Biology) (Biology) 
To: birding ; BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Tue, Jul 8, 2014 12:21 pm
Subject: RE: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch


Peterson, as is true for most of us, read widely and talked with many people.  
If he had to trace each song transliteration and each clever description of a 
field mark to its source, we might still be waiting for the first edition of 
his 

field guide, which would be at least twice as long and heavy.

Tracing song transliterations and descriptive phrases is fun but difficult, and 

the first person to put something in print is not necessarily the first person 
to have coined a phrase (I have heard a lot of identification lore in the field 

from people I know and from people I've encountered for only a few seconds to 
minutes).  If Gunn was the first to say "Chip, chupety," I wonder if he was 
responding to Seton's earlier "rup-it-chee" ; perhaps he had heard the Seton 
transliteration many years previously and was attempting to reproduce it 
without 

remembering where he had heard it.

Does anyone know who first credited the Eastern Towhee with "Drink your tea"? I 

once traced it to the 1930s, when Peterson and William Bacon Evans used it 
around the same time, and I thought that one of them might have coined it; now 
I 

see it in Forbush (1929), and it may well be earlier. How much more research do 

I need to do before I can finish the towhee entry for my field guide and move 
on 

to the vexing questions of who first discovered that Chestnut-sided Warblers 
want to see Miss Beecher (and who was it that thought they want to kill their 
teacher?), who first said that Red-tailed Hawks can often be identified by a 
"belly band," etc.?  Once we establish all the connections between Purple 
Finches and raspberry juice (and I think that I've added a bit to Rick's work 
at 

his web site), we can try to find who first applied strawberry juice to House 
Finches . . . .

By the way, Peterson does acknowledge the Bent series as a major source in the 
preface to the first edition (1934) of his field guide.

David

David Spector
Belchertown, Massachusetts, U.S.





________________________________________
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line) 
[BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] 

On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM [birding AT AOL.COM]
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 11:11 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch

Rick and Chatters,

While many of Peterson's song descriptions are cleverly succinct and quite 
informative, as with Neltje Blanchan's purple finch, many of his phonetics are 
"picked" from earlier authorities and observers, without any credit being 
given. 

One exception is William Gunn's famous description of the Canada Warbler's song 

"Chip, chupety swee-ditchety", which gives credit to "(Gunn)".

Arthur Cleveland Bent's Life Histories series provides a great number of 
phonetics and descriptions for bird songs, that Peterson obviously availed 
himself of, for use in his guides. It seems that no one ever objected to this 
use of sources, without credit being given, whether it be the original authors 
(if still alive), family members or publishers, or for that matter, anyone in 
the birding community. Even if, as a government publication, the Bent series 
was 

in the public domain, would it not be a courtesy to acknowledge a source (as he 

did in the case of William Gunn)?

All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com




-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Wright 
To: BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Sat, Jul 5, 2014 8:58 am
Subject: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch


Now there's a name you don't see nowadays. I've written a brief note about
her most memorable -- and utterly unknown -- contribution to Roger Tory
Peterson's first field guide at http://birdingnewjersey.com .

--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey 
ABA Field Guide to Birds of New Jersey

 


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html



BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html



 

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: field guides and sources
From: Rick Wright <birdaz AT GMAIL.COM>
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 14:21:05 -0400
Very happy to see this conversation continuing. If you haven't already, go
have a look at David Spector's eye-opening comment on my original blog
entry; he deepens the story substantially.
What I think is important to remember is that the young Peterson was fully
aware of his role as a compiler, a codifier, almost an anthologizer, and
that he expected his reader to understand that the material, even the
words, he was presenting had ultimately corporate rather than personal
origins. That, and not any fundamental dishonesty, seems to me to be the
reason that he could quote a line from, say, Chapman without any
attribution. It's worth rereading the field guides with an eye towards just
what Peterson means when he writes "we": he really does mean "me and all my
birding friends and colleagues" most of the time.

--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey 
ABA Field Guide to Birds of New Jersey

 


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch
From: Dick Cannings <dickcannings AT SHAW.CA>
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 09:53:30 -0700
Hi Gregg et al.:
Regarding Bill Gunn and his work, I can only contribute a memory from my
childhood in Penticton, BC.  My father was the local "bird expert" at the
time, and I remember Bill Gunn visiting us (I think this would have been the
early 60s).  He had a van with side opening doors that revealed a large
parabolic reflector.  He was in the Okanagan Valley hoping to record some of
the western specialty birds there, but unfortunately I didn't get to go out
in the field with him so can't report on his methods there.
regards
Dick Cannings
Penticton, BC


-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Gorton, Gregg
Sent: July-08-14 9:17 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple
finch

Ernie,

You make an excellent point, with which I agree whole-heartedly. Indeed some
of the mnemonics go back to Burroughs and other early nature writers. By
crediting them, we would also preserve memory of their crucial
contributions....  I once had thought to catalog such mnemonics and their
sources, but other activities have prevented that, and now with Apps, etc.,
their value is diminishing somewhat. But if one's auditory memory style is
to use onomatopoeic phrases or other (perhaps descriptive) phrases, they are
still a valuable way to learn and remember...

You mention William W.H. Gunn.  Many are not aware of his very important
work as an early bird recordist.  Do you (Ernie, or anyone else) know how
one might best become acquainted with his life and work?   Googling his name
produces only many of his recordings at the Macaulay Library and lists of
his LP records, but no Wiki listing, or other reference that might flesh him
out, so to speak...   I plan to include him in a paper I am writing on the
history of early Neotropical bird recording, so I would appreciate any
leads....  (Gunn recorded in Venezuela in the late 1950s, with assistance
from another great pioneer bird recordist, Paul Schwartz, but he did little
or  nothing else in the Neotropics. However his recording entitled "A Day at
Flores Moradas" -- a ranch in Venezuela named for purple flowers--was the
very first commercial recording of Neotropical birds ever released, several
years before a series of recordings by Schwartz and early recordings by
Johan Dalgas Frisch!
   in Brazil.

Thanks for any help anyone can provide with regard to Gunn and his work!

Gregg

Gregg Gorton
University of Pennsylvania
Homoaves at gmail.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line)
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM
Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 11:11 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch

Rick and Chatters,

While many of Peterson's song descriptions are cleverly succinct and quite
informative, as with Neltje Blanchan's purple finch, many of his phonetics
are "picked" from earlier authorities and observers, without any credit
being given. One exception is William Gunn's famous description of the
Canada Warbler's song "Chip, chupety swee-ditchety", which gives credit to
"(Gunn)".

Arthur Cleveland Bent's Life Histories series provides a great number of
phonetics and descriptions for bird songs, that Peterson obviously availed
himself of, for use in his guides. It seems that no one ever objected to
this use of sources, without credit being given, whether it be the original
authors (if still alive), family members or publishers, or for that matter,
anyone in the birding community. Even if, as a government publication, the
Bent series was in the public domain, would it not be a courtesy to
acknowledge a source (as he did in the case of William Gunn)?

All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com




-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Wright 
To: BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Sat, Jul 5, 2014 8:58 am
Subject: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch


Now there's a name you don't see nowadays. I've written a brief note about
her most memorable -- and utterly unknown -- contribution to Roger Tory
Peterson's first field guide at http://birdingnewjersey.com .

--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey  ABA Field Guide to Birds of
New Jersey


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html



BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: Neltje Blanchan's purple finch
From: "Gorton, Gregg" <Gregg.Gorton AT VA.GOV>
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 12:32:43 -0400
... Touche! And, to take it back even further, in the Neotropics some accepted 
common bird names are derived from onomatopoeic phrases that originated with 
indigenous groups... I wonder whether any of our American Indians are part of 
that great flow of oral information regarding a few of our North American bird 
friends. Just off the top of my head, I wander whether chachalaca might be one 
of those... --Of course, someone would have to check the original species 
description... 


Cheers,

Gregg

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line) 
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of Spector, David (Biology) 

Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 12:22 PM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch

Peterson, as is true for most of us, read widely and talked with many people. 
If he had to trace each song transliteration and each clever description of a 
field mark to its source, we might still be waiting for the first edition of 
his field guide, which would be at least twice as long and heavy. 


Tracing song transliterations and descriptive phrases is fun but difficult, and 
the first person to put something in print is not necessarily the first person 
to have coined a phrase (I have heard a lot of identification lore in the field 
from people I know and from people I've encountered for only a few seconds to 
minutes). If Gunn was the first to say "Chip, chupety," I wonder if he was 
responding to Seton's earlier "rup-it-chee" ; perhaps he had heard the Seton 
transliteration many years previously and was attempting to reproduce it 
without remembering where he had heard it. 


Does anyone know who first credited the Eastern Towhee with "Drink your tea"? I 
once traced it to the 1930s, when Peterson and William Bacon Evans used it 
around the same time, and I thought that one of them might have coined it; now 
I see it in Forbush (1929), and it may well be earlier. How much more research 
do I need to do before I can finish the towhee entry for my field guide and 
move on to the vexing questions of who first discovered that Chestnut-sided 
Warblers want to see Miss Beecher (and who was it that thought they want to 
kill their teacher?), who first said that Red-tailed Hawks can often be 
identified by a "belly band," etc.? Once we establish all the connections 
between Purple Finches and raspberry juice (and I think that I've added a bit 
to Rick's work at his web site), we can try to find who first applied 
strawberry juice to House Finches . . . . 


By the way, Peterson does acknowledge the Bent series as a major source in the 
preface to the first edition (1934) of his field guide. 


David

David Spector
Belchertown, Massachusetts, U.S.





________________________________________
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line) 
[BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM [birding AT AOL.COM] 

Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 11:11 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch

Rick and Chatters,

While many of Peterson's song descriptions are cleverly succinct and quite 
informative, as with Neltje Blanchan's purple finch, many of his phonetics are 
"picked" from earlier authorities and observers, without any credit being 
given. One exception is William Gunn's famous description of the Canada 
Warbler's song "Chip, chupety swee-ditchety", which gives credit to "(Gunn)". 


Arthur Cleveland Bent's Life Histories series provides a great number of 
phonetics and descriptions for bird songs, that Peterson obviously availed 
himself of, for use in his guides. It seems that no one ever objected to this 
use of sources, without credit being given, whether it be the original authors 
(if still alive), family members or publishers, or for that matter, anyone in 
the birding community. Even if, as a government publication, the Bent series 
was in the public domain, would it not be a courtesy to acknowledge a source 
(as he did in the case of William Gunn)? 


All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com




-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Wright 
To: BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Sat, Jul 5, 2014 8:58 am
Subject: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch


Now there's a name you don't see nowadays. I've written a brief note about her 
most memorable -- and utterly unknown -- contribution to Roger Tory Peterson's 
first field guide at http://birdingnewjersey.com . 


--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey  ABA Field Guide to Birds of 
New Jersey 
 


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html



BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: Neltje Blanchan's purple finch
From: "Spector, David (Biology)" <spectord AT MAIL.CCSU.EDU>
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 12:21:32 -0400
Peterson, as is true for most of us, read widely and talked with many people. 
If he had to trace each song transliteration and each clever description of a 
field mark to its source, we might still be waiting for the first edition of 
his field guide, which would be at least twice as long and heavy. 


Tracing song transliterations and descriptive phrases is fun but difficult, and 
the first person to put something in print is not necessarily the first person 
to have coined a phrase (I have heard a lot of identification lore in the field 
from people I know and from people I've encountered for only a few seconds to 
minutes). If Gunn was the first to say "Chip, chupety," I wonder if he was 
responding to Seton's earlier "rup-it-chee" ; perhaps he had heard the Seton 
transliteration many years previously and was attempting to reproduce it 
without remembering where he had heard it. 


Does anyone know who first credited the Eastern Towhee with "Drink your tea"? I 
once traced it to the 1930s, when Peterson and William Bacon Evans used it 
around the same time, and I thought that one of them might have coined it; now 
I see it in Forbush (1929), and it may well be earlier. How much more research 
do I need to do before I can finish the towhee entry for my field guide and 
move on to the vexing questions of who first discovered that Chestnut-sided 
Warblers want to see Miss Beecher (and who was it that thought they want to 
kill their teacher?), who first said that Red-tailed Hawks can often be 
identified by a "belly band," etc.? Once we establish all the connections 
between Purple Finches and raspberry juice (and I think that I've added a bit 
to Rick's work at his web site), we can try to find who first applied 
strawberry juice to House Finches . . . . 


By the way, Peterson does acknowledge the Bent series as a major source in the 
preface to the first edition (1934) of his field guide. 


David

David Spector
Belchertown, Massachusetts, U.S.





________________________________________
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line) 
[BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM [birding AT AOL.COM] 

Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 11:11 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch

Rick and Chatters,

While many of Peterson's song descriptions are cleverly succinct and quite 
informative, as with Neltje Blanchan's purple finch, many of his phonetics are 
"picked" from earlier authorities and observers, without any credit being 
given. One exception is William Gunn's famous description of the Canada 
Warbler's song "Chip, chupety swee-ditchety", which gives credit to "(Gunn)". 


Arthur Cleveland Bent's Life Histories series provides a great number of 
phonetics and descriptions for bird songs, that Peterson obviously availed 
himself of, for use in his guides. It seems that no one ever objected to this 
use of sources, without credit being given, whether it be the original authors 
(if still alive), family members or publishers, or for that matter, anyone in 
the birding community. Even if, as a government publication, the Bent series 
was in the public domain, would it not be a courtesy to acknowledge a source 
(as he did in the case of William Gunn)? 


All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com




-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Wright 
To: BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Sat, Jul 5, 2014 8:58 am
Subject: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch


Now there's a name you don't see nowadays. I've written a brief note about
her most memorable -- and utterly unknown -- contribution to Roger Tory
Peterson's first field guide at http://birdingnewjersey.com .

--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey 
ABA Field Guide to Birds of New Jersey

 


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html



BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch
From: "Gorton, Gregg" <Gregg.Gorton AT VA.GOV>
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 12:17:21 -0400
Ernie,

You make an excellent point, with which I agree whole-heartedly. Indeed some of 
the mnemonics go back to Burroughs and other early nature writers. By crediting 
them, we would also preserve memory of their crucial contributions.... I once 
had thought to catalog such mnemonics and their sources, but other activities 
have prevented that, and now with Apps, etc., their value is diminishing 
somewhat. But if one's auditory memory style is to use onomatopoeic phrases or 
other (perhaps descriptive) phrases, they are still a valuable way to learn and 
remember... 


You mention William W.H. Gunn. Many are not aware of his very important work as 
an early bird recordist. Do you (Ernie, or anyone else) know how one might best 
become acquainted with his life and work? Googling his name produces only many 
of his recordings at the Macaulay Library and lists of his LP records, but no 
Wiki listing, or other reference that might flesh him out, so to speak... I 
plan to include him in a paper I am writing on the history of early Neotropical 
bird recording, so I would appreciate any leads.... (Gunn recorded in Venezuela 
in the late 1950s, with assistance from another great pioneer bird recordist, 
Paul Schwartz, but he did little or nothing else in the Neotropics. However his 
recording entitled "A Day at Flores Moradas" -- a ranch in Venezuela named for 
purple flowers--was the very first commercial recording of Neotropical birds 
ever released, several years before a series of recordings by Schwartz and 
early recordings by Johan Dalgas Frisch! 

   in Brazil.

Thanks for any help anyone can provide with regard to Gunn and his work!

Gregg

Gregg Gorton
University of Pennsylvania
Homoaves at gmail.com

-----Original Message-----
From: National Birding Hotline Cooperative (Chat Line) 
[mailto:BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU] On Behalf Of birding AT AOL.COM 

Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 11:11 AM
To: BIRDCHAT AT LISTSERV.KSU.EDU
Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch

Rick and Chatters,

While many of Peterson's song descriptions are cleverly succinct and quite 
informative, as with Neltje Blanchan's purple finch, many of his phonetics are 
"picked" from earlier authorities and observers, without any credit being 
given. One exception is William Gunn's famous description of the Canada 
Warbler's song "Chip, chupety swee-ditchety", which gives credit to "(Gunn)". 


Arthur Cleveland Bent's Life Histories series provides a great number of 
phonetics and descriptions for bird songs, that Peterson obviously availed 
himself of, for use in his guides. It seems that no one ever objected to this 
use of sources, without credit being given, whether it be the original authors 
(if still alive), family members or publishers, or for that matter, anyone in 
the birding community. Even if, as a government publication, the Bent series 
was in the public domain, would it not be a courtesy to acknowledge a source 
(as he did in the case of William Gunn)? 


All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com




-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Wright 
To: BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Sat, Jul 5, 2014 8:58 am
Subject: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch


Now there's a name you don't see nowadays. I've written a brief note about her 
most memorable -- and utterly unknown -- contribution to Roger Tory Peterson's 
first field guide at http://birdingnewjersey.com . 


--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey  ABA Field Guide to Birds of 
New Jersey 
 


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html



BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: Neltje Blanchan's purple finch
From: birding AT AOL.COM
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 11:11:27 -0400
Rick and Chatters,
 
While many of Peterson's song descriptions are cleverly succinct and quite 
informative, as with Neltje Blanchan's purple finch, many of his phonetics are 
"picked" from earlier authorities and observers, without any credit being 
given. One exception is William Gunn's famous description of the Canada 
Warbler's song "Chip, chupety swee-ditchety", which gives credit to "(Gunn)". 


Arthur Cleveland Bent's Life Histories series provides a great number of 
phonetics and descriptions for bird songs, that Peterson obviously availed 
himself of, for use in his guides. It seems that no one ever objected to this 
use of sources, without credit being given, whether it be the original authors 
(if still alive), family members or publishers, or for that matter, anyone in 
the birding community. Even if, as a government publication, the Bent series 
was in the public domain, would it not be a courtesy to acknowledge a source 
(as he did in the case of William Gunn)? 


All the best,
Ernie Jardine
Pickering Ontario

birding AT aol.com

www.birdsongidentification.com


 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Rick Wright 
To: BIRDCHAT 
Sent: Sat, Jul 5, 2014 8:58 am
Subject: [BIRDCHAT] Neltje Blanchan's purple finch


Now there's a name you don't see nowadays. I've written a brief note about
her most memorable -- and utterly unknown -- contribution to Roger Tory
Peterson's first field guide at http://birdingnewjersey.com .

--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey 
ABA Field Guide to Birds of New Jersey

 


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html

 

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: BirdNote, last week & the week of July 6, 2014
From: Ellen Blackstone <ellen AT 123IMAGINE.NET>
Date: Sat, 5 Jul 2014 09:14:51 -0700
Hello, BirdChat,

Want to share BirdNote with a friend? Check out these four one-minute
*BirdNote Moments* for July: http://bit.ly/1sej62n
----------------------------------------------
Last week, BirdNote aired:

* Hoatzin! A strange bird of the Amazon

http://bit.ly/NC8eVZ

* Climate Change Is Pushing Tropical Birds Off the Mountaintop in Papua
New Guinea
http://bit.ly/VNKhH1

* Protecting the World's Cranes, With George Archibald
http://bit.ly/VrtkSb

* What's That Bird? Taking the Kids Outdoors!
http://bit.ly/1mUp6Ig

* Waterfalls, Caves, and White-collared Swifts
http://bit.ly/LuTJ71

* National Symbol - Wild Turkey vs. Bald Eagle
http://bit.ly/Nm0OHr

* Birds as Pollinators - With an amazing photo of a Rainbow Lorikeet
http://bit.ly/VNKGJi
------------------------------------------------------------
View the photos and links for next week's shows: http://p0.vresp.com/dPyq7Z
------------------------------------------------------------
Find us on Facebook. Search for birdnote.
... or Follow us on Twitter. Search for birdnoteradio
=========================================
You can listen to the mp3, see a photo, read the transcript, sign up for
weekly mail or the podcast, and find related resources on the website.
http://www.birdnote.org All 1100+ episodes are in the archive.

Thanks for listening!
Ellen Blackstone, BirdNote

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Neltje Blanchan's purple finch
From: Rick Wright <birdaz AT GMAIL.COM>
Date: Sat, 5 Jul 2014 08:56:11 -0400
Now there's a name you don't see nowadays. I've written a brief note about
her most memorable -- and utterly unknown -- contribution to Roger Tory
Peterson's first field guide at http://birdingnewjersey.com .

--
Rick Wright
Bloomfield, NJ

Review Editor, Birding 
Senior Leader, WINGS 
Birding New Jersey 
ABA Field Guide to Birds of New Jersey

 


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Hilton Pond 06/14/14 (What Is The Piedmont?)
From: "Bill Hilton Jr. (RESEARCH)" <research AT HILTONPOND.ORG>
Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2014 18:42:47 -0400
I apologize for the link error in my previous e-mail. It is corrected below.

Big news! As I join other U.S. citizens in celebrating the Fourth of July, I 
also observe another event: The publication of my 600th installment of "This 
Week at Hilton Pond." This anniversary edition returns to the Center's roots in 
answering the question: "What is the Piedmont?" and as a bonus includes a 
portfolio of 50-plus images of flora, fauna, and phenomena I've observed 
locally in 15 years since I started this blog. Also included is recognition for 
those special folks who contributed to Hilton Pond Center the latter half of 
June. It's all on-line at http://www.hiltonpond.org/ThisWeek140614.html 


Don't forget to scroll down for a list of birds banded or recaptured during the 
period. (Note the especially old returning hummingbird.) 


Happy (Anniversary) Nature Watching!

BILL

P.S. Please "Like" our new Facebook page at http://www.facebook.com/HiltonPond 
for timely updates on nature topics. Follow us on Twitter  AT hiltonpond. 


=========

RESEARCH PROGRAM
c/o BILL HILTON JR., D.Sci.
Executive Director
Hilton Pond Center for Piedmont Natural History
1432 DeVinney Road, York, South Carolina 29745 USA
office & cell (803) 684-5852

Please visit our web sites (courtesy of Comporium.net):
Hilton Pond Center for Piedmont Natural History at http://www.hiltonpond.org 
"Operation RubyThroat: The Hummingbird Project" at http://www.rubythroat.org

==================


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Hilton Pond 06/14/14 (What Is The Piedmont?)
From: "Bill Hilton Jr. (RESEARCH)" <research AT HILTONPOND.ORG>
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2014 21:30:59 -0400
Big news! As I join other U.S. citizens in celebrating the Fourth of July, I 
also observe another event: The publication of my 600th installment of "This 
Week at Hilton Pond." This anniversary edition returns to the Center's roots in 
answering the question: "What is the Piedmont?" and as a bonus includes a 
portfolio of 50-plus images of flora, fauna, and phenomena I've observed 
locally in 15 years since I started this blog. Also included is recognition for 
those special folks who contributed to Hilton Pond Center the latter half of 
June. It's all on-line athttp://www.hiltonpond.org/ThisWeek140614.html 


Don't forget to scroll down for a list of birds banded or recaptured during the 
period. (Note the especially old returning hummingbird.) 


Happy (Anniversary) Nature Watching!

BILL

P.S. Please "Like" our new Facebook page at http://www.facebook.com/HiltonPond 
for timely updates on nature topics. Follow us on Twitter  AT hiltonpond. 


=========

RESEARCH PROGRAM
c/o BILL HILTON JR., D.Sci.
Executive Director
Hilton Pond Center for Piedmont Natural History
1432 DeVinney Road, York, South Carolina 29745 USA
office & cell (803) 684-5852

Please visit our web sites (courtesy of Comporium.net):
Hilton Pond Center for Piedmont Natural History at http://www.hiltonpond.org 
"Operation RubyThroat: The Hummingbird Project" at http://www.rubythroat.org

==================


BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
Archives: http://listserv.ksu.edu/archives/birdchat.html
Subject: Re: Where to go in early August between Ontario and Virginia?
From: "Patrick C. Hodgson" <hadu AT SYMPATICO.CA>
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2014 13:01:39 -0400
Morten,

Right, not the greatest time, especially for warblers as they are
dispersed, not exhibiting territorial behaviors, and not migrating.
Black-billed cuckoo will be tough too, as they are not really common
anywhere and when not calling are very easy to miss.  This will actually
be a pretty good time for waders, we call them shorebirds over here, as
fall migration will already be underway for them.

Are you familiar with using ebird.org to find interesting recent
sightings, or patterns of time and geography in past years?  For
instance, go to "explore data" then "range and point maps" where you can
set the date to only the months of interest and a few recent years.
For upland sandpiper, your best bet might actually be a side trip to
Carden, Ontario, which is less than 2 hours drive from Toronto, but in
the opposite direction from your main trip.  Other than that, a look at
ebird suggests a few widely scattered sites in upstate New York as
possibilities, as well as Delaware.  I would suggest trying out at least
one of the Delaware spots on your way to Bombay Hook NWR in Delaware, a
great spot for shorebirds.  Then take the ferry from Lewes, DE to Cape
May, NJ.  Stop in at the CMBO (Cape May Birding Observatory), and they
can help out you with some local suggestions.  A boat trip in the salt
marsh is always fun here. CMBO should be able to direct you to a nearby
location for red-headed woodpecker for sure.  Then head up the coast a
bit to Forsythe NWR near Atlantic City, another great shorebird place
where you have at least some chance of seeing Hudsonian godwit.  Having
a scope is very useful here and at Bombay Hook.  Wear long clothing in
the salt marshes (both NWRs) as there are some nasty biting flies.

I think your instinct is right and you should go through the Adirondacks
in northern NY on your way back to Toronto, as the drive down to DC via
Buffalo is not that great.  The Adirondacks have tons of outdoor
opportunities for birding.  Yellow-bellied sapsucker is certainly
possible there, but they will be spread out and you may have to get
lucky.  The Paul Smiths College Visitor Interpretive Center is just one
example of a good spot with trails through a wide variety of habitats.
Going this way also allows for some scenic driving through the 1000
Islands area of the St. Lawrence River between Ontario and New York, a
very beautiful area.

Have a great trip!
Pat Hodgson
Toronto, Canada

BirdChat Guidelines: http://www.ksbirds.org/birdchat/
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Subject: Where to go in early August between Ontario and Virginia?
From: Morten Gnther <morten AT LAPPUGLE.NET>
Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2014 00:02:55 +0200
Hello all!

 

Im planning a three week trip to Eastern North-America starting later this
month.

This will be a family trip with some birding, starting and ending in
Toronto, ON.

We will go south to Harrisonburg and Richmond, VA, and also to Washington
D.C. 

On our way back north I also plan to check out parts of the coastline
between Virginia Beach and New York.

 

I know this is not the best part of the year for birding, but I still hope
to catch up with a few species Ive missed on previous trips.

Any advice on good areas for general birding and bird photography in this
area are most welcome. Any good places for waders on the coast?

Is it worthwhile going back on the east and north side of Lake Ontario?
Maybe we can have some good birds upstate New York in the surroundings of
Lake Placid?

 

Some target species:

 

-        Upland Sandpiper

-        Hudsonian Godwit

-        Black-billed Cuckoo

-        Red-headed Woodpecker

-        Yellow-bellied Sapsucker

-        And plenty of warblers J

 

Any suggestions for routes and locations are welcome!

 

Best regards

 

Morten

 

 

Morten Gnther

N-1615 FREDRIKSTAD

NORWAY

 

 


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Subject: Link to story about European raptor poaching
From: "Barry K. MacKay" <mimus AT SYMPATICO.CA>
Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2014 12:29:41 -0400
http://www.cites.org/eng/cites_welcomes_Belgian_court_judgement_illegal_trad
e_birds_prey



the link I sent may not work; try this one (works for me).



Barry





Barry Kent MacKay

Bird Artist, Illustrator

Studio: (905)-472-9731

http://www.barrykentmackay.ca
mimus AT sympatico.ca

Markham, Ontario, Canada




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Subject: Belgian court judgement on illegal trade in birds of prey
From: "Barry K. MacKay" <mimus AT SYMPATICO.CA>
Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2014 11:56:14 -0400
Some good news...a criminal organization that had been operating across
Europe for poaching Imperial Eagles, Peregrine Falcons, Egyptian Vultures,
Bonelli's Eagles, Golden Eagles, Booted Eagles, Merlins, European Hobbies,
Western Red-footed Falcons, Lesser Kestrels, Black-winged Kites, Black
Kites, Snowy Owls and Short-eared Owls were brought to justice and fined up
to ninety thousand Euros (about 122,870 U.S.)

The scheme they undertook was similar to one I helped expose in Canada
decades ago, whereby chicks and eggs are taken from the wild and placed with
registered captive birds and then themselves registered as "captive bred" so
they could be given appropriate permits for trade under provisions of the
Convention on International Trade in Endangered Species of Wild Fauna and
Flora (CITES) or other conservation legislation.

I had no such satisfactory outcome but it's good to see that these four
miscreants were given heavy fines and jail terms of one to four years.

http://www.cites.org/eng/cites_welcomes_Belgian_court_judgement_illegal_trad
e_birds_prey

Cheers,

Barry



____________________


Barry Kent MacKay
Bird Artist, Illustrator
Studio: (905)-472-9731
http://www.barrykentmackay.ca
mimus AT sympatico.ca
Markham, Ontario, Canada

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