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4 Jul Re: Damselfly to identify, please... ["J J Daigle" ] 3 Jul Damselfly to identify, please... ["Pilon, Michel" ] 2 Jul Re: Collecting was not the problem [Dennis Paulson ] 1 Jul Re: Collecting was not the problems [] 1 Jul Re: Collecting was not the problems ["O'Brien, Mark" ] 29 Jun Re: +AFs-Odonata-l+AF0- Collecting was not the problems ["Frederico A.A. Lencioni" ] 29 Jun Re: Collecting was not the problems [] 29 Jun Re: Collecting was not the problems [Joshua Rose ] 29 Jun Collecting was not the problems ["Bob Glotzhober" ] 29 Jun Recommended article from Journal Watch Online: Save a Species 101 [Bob Glotzhober ] 28 Jun Re: BBC - Earth News - Legless frogs mystery solved [Dennis Paulson ] 28 Jun Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam [Joshua Rose ] 28 Jun Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam [Glenn Corbiere ] 28 Jun Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam ["Marion Dobbs" ] 28 Jun Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam [Richard Rowe ] 27 Jun odonate photos needed [Dennis Paulson ] 27 Jun odonate photos needed [Dennis Paulson ] 27 Jun odonate photos needed [Dennis Paulson ] 27 Jun odonate photos needed [Dennis Paulson ] 27 Jun odonate photos needed [Dennis Paulson ] 27 Jun odonate photos needed [Dennis Paulson ] 27 Jun Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam [John Acorn ] 27 Jun Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam [John Acorn ] 27 Jun Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam ["Dave Small" ] 26 Jun Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam [Glenn Corbiere ] 26 Jun Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam [Joshua Rose ] 27 Jun Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam [Richard Rowe ] 26 Jun Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer ["Lawson, Tamara" ] 26 Jun BBC - Earth News - Legless frogs mystery solved [Kathy &/or Dave Biggs ] 26 Jun BBC - Earth News - Legless frogs mystery solved [Kathy &/or Dave Biggs ] 26 Jun Frog legs and odonates - attempt #2 [Michael Blust ] 26 Jun Frog legs and odonates [Michael Blust ] 25 Jun address change ["David Tobis" ] 24 Jun Odonata Front Cover Journal of Zoology (current issue) [Alex Ardila ] 8 Jun Dragonflies on TV ["McCormac, Jim" ] 7 Jun Re: Could it be a Variable Darner??? (No response up to now...) ["Dubois, Robert - DNR" ] 7 Jun Re: Could it be a Variable Darner??? (No response up to now...) [Jim Johnson ] 6 Jun Could it be a Variable Darner??? (No response up to now...) ["Pilon, Michel" ] 4 Jun Could it be a Variable Darner??? ["Pilon, Michel" ] 4 Jun Re: Request for ARGIA Contributions [Todd Sformo ] 25 May Animal Planet show about dragonflies ["wjsigman" ] 25 May Sound of dragonfly in flight? ["wjsigman" ] 19 May Re: Request for ARGIA Contributions [John Abbott ] 19 May Re: Request for ARGIA Contributions [John Abbott ] 19 May Re: Request for ARGIA Contributions [John Abbott ] 19 May Re: Request for ARGIA Contributions [John Abbott ] 19 May Re: Request for ARGIA Contributions [John Abbott ] 19 May Re: Request for ARGIA Contributions [John Abbott ] 18 May Dragonfly status [Chris Hill ] 13 May mistake in previous message about Syria [Dennis Paulson ] 13 May help wanted from Syria [Dennis Paulson ] 13 May Montgomery - Diastatops [Helmut Strasser ] 2 May Joe Engler/MOBILE/R1/FWS/DOI is out of the office. [] 2 May Re: Dennis Paulson's and other recent books ["Dubois, Robert - DNR" ] 2 May Re: Dennis Paulson's and other recent books [Dennis Paulson ] 24 Apr Tera Baird is out of the office. Please see message. [] 23 Apr Re: Dennis Paulson's and other recent books ["Marion Dobbs" ] 22 Apr Re: Dennis Paulson's and other recent books [azurebluet ] 21 Apr Dennis Paulson's book ["Marion Dobbs" ] 19 Apr photos needed for field guide [Dennis Paulson ] 18 Apr Joe Engler/MOBILE/R1/FWS/DOI is out of the office. [] 17 Apr Regional Field Checklists ["Jim Johnson" ] 11 Apr Aquatic Insects Course ["info AT srilankaninsects.net" ] 10 Apr Aquatic Insect and Odonate workshop [Dennis Paulson ] 7 Apr North American Odonata checklist available [Dennis Paulson ] 7 Apr North American Odonata checklist available [Dennis Paulson ] 7 Apr North American Odonata checklist available [Dennis Paulson ] 7 Apr North American Odonata checklist available [Dennis Paulson ] 7 Apr North American Odonata checklist available [Dennis Paulson ] 7 Apr North American Odonata checklist available [Dennis Paulson ] 2 Apr Fwd: DSA Annual Meeting [Dennis Paulson ] 28 Mar Tera Baird is out of the office for a conference [] 27 Mar Worldwide Dragonfly Association [Dennis Paulson ] 7 Mar Observado.org - to register sightings of your dragonflies all over the world [Marcel Hospers ] 05 Mar Northeast DSA Meeting - IMPORTANT UPDATE [Bryan Pfeiffer ] 05 Mar Northeast DSA Meeting - IMPORTANT UPDATE [Bryan Pfeiffer ] Subject: Re: Damselfly to identify, please... From: "J J Daigle" <jdaigle AT nettally.com> Date: Sat, 4 Jul 2009 07:56:53 -0400 Aloha, Michel! Argia translata. Aloha nui! Jerrell ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pilon, Michel" To: Sent: Friday, July 03, 2009 5:22 PM Subject: [Odonata-l] Damselfly to identify, please... Hello all, During a business trip I went to Dallas, Texas last May 25th for a whole week. After work, I spent some time around the city to take Nature pictures (looking for insects, birds, plants, etc...). Here are two pictures I took of a damselfly from the Coenagrionidae family. I'm suspecting the Genus Argia but I'm not sure. I know that the backlight doesn't help (even if I like the light here) but do you think it is possible to confirm the Genus Argia or maybe the species??? Thank you very much for your always appreciated help. (Here are the links): http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu91.jpg http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu92.jpg Michel Pilon Photographe-Naturaliste Québec, Canada Mes Parcours Nature: http://parcours.pilonm.org Quiz de chants d'oiseaux http://parcours.pilonm.org/cgi-bin/sonOiseaux.pl Vous voulez être tenu au courant lorsque j'ajoute de nouvelles photos sur mon site web? N'hésitez pas à me contacter à mipilon AT rncan.gc.ca et je vous rajouterai avec plaisir sur ma liste de distribution... _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.375 / Virus Database: 270.13.3/2216 - Release Date: 07/03/09 05:53:00 _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Damselfly to identify, please... From: "Pilon, Michel" <Michel.Pilon AT rncan-nrcan.gc.ca> Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 17:22:31 -0400 Hello all, During a business trip I went to Dallas, Texas last May 25th for a whole week. After work, I spent some time around the city to take Nature pictures (looking for insects, birds, plants, etc...). Here are two pictures I took of a damselfly from the Coenagrionidae family. I'm suspecting the Genus Argia but I'm not sure. I know that the backlight doesn't help (even if I like the light here) but do you think it is possible to confirm the Genus Argia or maybe the species??? Thank you very much for your always appreciated help. (Here are the links): http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu91.jpg http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu92.jpg Michel Pilon Photographe-Naturaliste Québec, Canada Mes Parcours Nature: http://parcours.pilonm.org Quiz de chants d'oiseaux http://parcours.pilonm.org/cgi-bin/sonOiseaux.pl Vous voulez être tenu au courant lorsque j'ajoute de nouvelles photos sur mon site web? N'hésitez pas à me contacter à mipilon AT rncan.gc.ca et je vous rajouterai avec plaisir sur ma liste de distribution... _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Collecting was not the problem From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 08:12:38 -0700 I agree with all these thoughts from my own experience and talking with others. We really have to try to counter this trend. One way to get people, including kids, more interested in odonates is to bring the odonates to them by constructing ponds. As dragonflies are aquatic creatures, they're not so spread evenly around the landscape as other insect groups might be, and you have to help them along. This can be done almost anywhere, and in Japan they have programs for doing so on school grounds. Of course in the USA, litigious capital of the world, someone would object that a student could drown in a two-foot-deep pond, or that it would attract sex offenders. These attitudes are also among the reasons why children are kept out of nature, why we have such well-developed nature-deficit disorder in our society. But if schools fail us, perhaps nature centers and interested citizens could take on such projects. It cost us about $1000 (local handymen digging it, butyl liner, some aquatic plants from local nursery) to build a 19x11' pond, up to 3' deep, in our yard, and I suppose with volunteers you might get the cost down even more. If the site is located not too far from natural wetlands, it will attract odonates immediately, as well as other aquatic insects and perhaps even amhibians. It's a source of water for local birds and mammals and is guaranteed to enhance biodiversity in the immediate surroundings, especially if native upland vegetation can be added around it. There are websites about pond-building, and I think every odonate society and local group should consider this activity, especially in urban and suburban areas. ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net On Jul 1, 2009, at 7:20 PM, DENBROO AT aol.com wrote: > I agree that with each generation we lose more contact with the > outdoors. > I'm relating to experiences, as someone who works as an educator at > a local nature center and does his own outreach programs. > There is always a barrage of questions when children view our > displays. > Generally they follow the line; are they real who killed them and > why, which followed by an explanation on the various ways these > displays were obtained and why they have opportunity to view these > creatures. > I find the children that are more removed from the outdoors are the > ones that are the ones that are more offended and ask the most > questions. > Unfortunately, with greater urbanization and more distractions > there is no simple explanation or resolution to this perpetuating > problem of getting kids outdoors. > > > Denny Brooks > Midland, Michigan _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Collecting was not the problems From: DENBROO AT aol.com Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 22:20:19 EDT I agree that with each generation we lose more contact with the outdoors. I'm relating to experiences, as someone who works as an educator at a local nature center and does his own outreach programs. There is always a barrage of questions when children view our displays. Generally they follow the line; are they real who killed them and why, which followed by an explanation on the various ways these displays were obtained and why they have opportunity to view these creatures. I find the children that are more removed from the outdoors are the ones that are the ones that are more offended and ask the most questions. Unfortunately, with greater urbanization and more distractions there is no simple explanation or resolution to this perpetuating problem of getting kids outdoors. Denny Brooks Midland, Michigan **************Make your summer sizzle with fast and easy recipes for the grill. (http://food.aol.com/grilling?ncid=emlcntusfood00000005)_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Collecting was not the problems From: "O'Brien, Mark" <mfobrien AT umich.edu> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 09:11:47 -0400 I think it has less to do with consciousness about collecting than it has to do with the disconnect that we see today between kids and the natural world. Not that they aren't bombarded with fun science facts, etc., but the unstructured ability to go and explore and learn without a "guide." On top of that, many have parents that are disconnected from the world of insects, and live in air-tight homes, etc., etc. In addition, many 4-H groups lack the parents that have an interest in entomology, plants, etc., and it has become a contest with who can get the most ribbons... I was involved in 4-H for a number of years, and the kids in our club always had good collections with well-labeled specimens, etc. So, it depends upon the resources that kids are exposed to and the environment in which they are raised. When told by parents that bugs are icky, they collect things like keychains. Mark On 06/29/2009 5:11 PM, "DENBROO AT aol.com" wrote: I think collecting as a whole is down. When I was a kid, just about anybody in scouts, 4-H, and Ag organizations had some sort of insect collections. Today it is rare to you see more than 10 on display at the county fair. The collections that are generally offered to our nature center are 40 years older or older. Kids today are extremely conscious about any kind of collecting. Denny Brooks Midland, Michigan ________________________________ =================================== Mark F. O'Brien, Collection Manager UMMZ Insect Division, 1109 Geddes Avenue University of Michigan, Ann Arbor, MI 48109-1079 734-647-2199 fax: 734-763-4080 =================================== _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: +AFs-Odonata-l+AF0- Collecting was not the problems From: "Frederico A.A. Lencioni" <odonata AT zygoptera.bio.br> Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 22:36:08 -0300 I think this is a worldwide phenomenon, caused in my humble oppinion for four major factors : 1st - The large majority of the population lives in high poluted urban areas with a very few beauty, big and colorfull insects+ADs- 2nd - The growing estrangement of the outdoors, where you can seen animals and the constant influences of television, videogame and internet+ADs- 3rd - The decline of children teaching, teachers extremely badly formed and indifferent to the students' formation+ADs- 4th - Lack of incentive (sometimes, as in Brazil, a true boycott) of the government for areas linked to the science and for base research. Frederico A.A. Lencioni Jacare+AO0-, SP, Brazil ----- Original Message ----- From: DENBROO+AEA-aol.com To: odonata-l+AEA-listhost.ups.edu Sent: Monday, June 29, 2009 6:11 PM Subject: Re: +AFs-Odonata-l+AF0- Collecting was not the problems I think collecting as a whole is down. When I was a kid, just about anybody in scouts, 4-H, and Ag organizations had some sort of insect collections. Today it is rare to you see more than 10 on display at the county fair. The collections that are generally offered to our nature center are 40 years older or older. Kids today are extremely conscious about any kind of collecting. Denny Brooks Midland, Michigan ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Make your summer sizzle with fast and easy recipes for the grill. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ +AF8AXwBfAF8AXwBfAF8AXwBfAF8AXwBfAF8AXwBfAF8AXwBfAF8AXwBfAF8AXwBfAF8AXwBfAF8AXwBfAF8AXwBfAF8AXwBfAF8AXwBfAF8AXwBfAF8AXwBfAF8AXw- Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l+AEA-listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Collecting was not the problems From: DENBROO AT aol.com Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 17:11:39 EDT I think collecting as a whole is down. When I was a kid, just about anybody in scouts, 4-H, and Ag organizations had some sort of insect collections. Today it is rare to you see more than 10 on display at the county fair. The collections that are generally offered to our nature center are 40 years older or older. Kids today are extremely conscious about any kind of collecting. Denny Brooks Midland, Michigan **************Make your summer sizzle with fast and easy recipes for the grill. (http://food.aol.com/grilling?ncid=emlcntusfood00000005)_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Collecting was not the problems From: Joshua Rose <opihi AT rgv.rr.com> Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:35:34 -0500 On Jun 29, 2009, at 7:02 AM, Bob Glotzhober wrote: > > Many people seem to be getting more and more negative on collecting > insects. I’m sure there may be some isolated cases where this can be > a problem, but again and again we see that insects that produce > hundreds or even thousands of eggs are not normally negatively > affected by collecting – but by habitat loss or change. > I am still somewhat mystified but very glad that the odonate-watchers and odonate collectors are still so united with each other. The animosity between watchers and collectors in the world of butterflies is so intense that I'm tempted to write a movie script... Josh Rose, McAllen TX _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Collecting was not the problems From: "Bob Glotzhober" <bglotzhober AT ohiohistory.org> Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 08:02:55 -0400 I tried to e-mail a copy of this article from Journal Watch - but not sure it made it - and if it did, I could not add a comment. Here is the link for the article in Journal Watch about Europe's "Large Blue Butterfly" http://journalwatch.conservationmagazine.org/2009/06/17/save-a-species-1 01/ The key from my perspective is that years ago it was thought by local workers that over-collecting was the cause of decline in the Large Blue Butterfly. This article points out that conclusion was in error, and it had to do with loss of ant species which in turn was due to decrease in grazing by cattle. The lessons: Don't be too quick to judge cause and effect; and, Another case where collecting was not a problem. Many people seem to be getting more and more negative on collecting insects. I'm sure there may be some isolated cases where this can be a problem, but again and again we see that insects that produce hundreds or even thousands of eggs are not normally negatively affected by collecting - but by habitat loss or change. Bob Glotzhober ==================== Robert C. Glotzhober 614/ 298-2054 Senior Curator, Natural History bglotzhober AT ohiohistory.org Ohio Historical Society Fax: 614/ 297-2546 1982 Velma Avenue Columbus, Ohio 43211-2497 Save Your Ohio History! The most recent state budget framework proposes to slash Ohio Historical Society funding from $13.5 million just two years ago to less than $7.5 million. These funding cuts can be restored, but only with your help. Go to www.saveohiohistory.org and take action. Thanks for your support! Visit the website of the Ohio Historical Society at: www.ohiohistory.org and check out our online collections catalog. Visit the Ohio Odonata website at: http://www.marietta.edu/~odonata/index.html _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Recommended article from Journal Watch Online: Save a Species 101 From: Bob Glotzhober <bglotzhober AT ohiohistory.org> Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 04:57:17 -0700 Hi Odonata ListServe, Your friend, Bob Glotzhober, has recommended the article entitled 'Save a Species 101' to you from Journal Watch Online (http://journalwatch.conservationmagazine.org). Save a Species 101 Posted By jessica On June 17, 2009 (1:26 pm) In Biodiversity, Community-based conservation, Endangered species, Habitat Scientists reverse the decline of "large blue" The large blue butterfly, a conservation emblem, is enjoying a second lease on life after being wiped out from Britain in 1979. A team of Oxford University scientists is now for the first time publishing the results from the four decades of work it took to get to this point. At first, scientists blamed butterfly collectors for the large blue’s mysterious woes, taking ineffective measures like fencing off their habitat as populations still dwindled. Then ecologist Jeremy Thomas took up residence with Britain’s last surviving colony in the early 1970s.  That colony itself soon disappeared but not before Thomas had collected enough data to trace five years’ of the large blue butterflies’ life cycle. Thomas and team realized that it wasn’t the hobbyists to blame. The butterflies’ unique reliance on a specific ant species to raise their young caterpillars, who disguise themselves as ant grubs, was the real problem. This ant had been declining too, because farmers’ had stopped grazing livestock, causing overgrown grass to cool the soil to the point where the ants’ couldn’t survive. Armed with this knowledge, a team devised a reintroduction plan that has over the last twenty five years led to the return of the large blue butterfly to more than 30 colonies throughout the country and reversed its decline. All of this, the authors say, provides a working model for the conservation of other butterflies and insects. While stopping overall habitat degradation might be more ideal, identifying and designing species-specific measures can sometimes be a practical approach. – Jessica Leber Source: Thomas, J.A. et al. Successful Conservation of a Threatened Maculinea Butterfly. Science DOI: 1126/science.1175726 Image Courtesy of David Simcox, Centre for Ecology and Hydrology, UK URL to article: http://journalwatch.conservationmagazine.org/2009/06/17/save-a-species-101/ _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: BBC - Earth News - Legless frogs mystery solved From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 08:59:13 -0700 Begin forwarded message: > From: "Mike Patterson" > Date: June 27, 2009 7:44:09 PM PDT > To: nw_odonata AT yahoogroups.com > Subject: [nw_odonata] Re: BBC - Earth News - Legless frogs mystery > solved > Reply-To: nw_odonata AT yahoogroups.com > > As is so often the case with science "news" this doesn't actually > solve the mystery. It's explains some of the cases of the missing > limb phenomena. > > I was at an amphibian conference in 2008 where one of the speakers > was Mike Lannoo. In his talk, Lannoo stressed that many folks were > looking for easy, non-anthropogenic answers. He was able to show, > through slides of many frog x-rays why predation answered only a > fraction of the malformation cases. Chemicals, cattle and > urbanization are all still contributors. > > He's written an entire book on the subject, _Malformed Frogs: The > Collapse of Aquatic Ecosystems_ (2008). An excerpt of the first > chapter can be found at:https://www.ucpress.edu/books/chapters/ > 11098.ch01.pdf > > > __,_._,___ ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam From: Joshua Rose <opihi AT rgv.rr.com> Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 01:40:04 -0500 On Jun 27, 2009, at 8:49 PM, Richard Rowe wrote: > Precisely. And until you have evidence it is NOT predation you > shouldn't seek more complicated explanations But that's just not true. One does not need to disprove that predation is a factor for other factors to be contributing. Predation may be PART of the more complicated explanation. Libellulid naiads and amphibian larvae are both present in a huge number of freshwater wetlands across the planet; but this syndrome of legless amphibians has been noted at a tiny minority of such wetlands. Just because predation is involved does not mean it is acting alone. But predation is obviously not sufficient all by itself, else amphibians would be conspicuously lacking limbs at every wetland where they overlapped with libellulids. It's too late at night for my brain to attempt to tie this back to the parsimony/Occam's Razor concept, but I still agree with the original point that the BBC article was making the odonate larvae out to be the sole worldwide cause, be-all and end-all, without including the necessary context. Josh Rose Ph.D. McAllen TX _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam From: Glenn Corbiere <gcorbiere AT dragonhunter.net> Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 07:15:04 -0700 (PDT) Congratulations on marvelous timing, Marion! I think that most of us reading this are in agreement that it is foolish to jump to a conclusion based on a small sampling at limited geographic locations, and to use that conclusion to try to explain a very wide ranging phenomena, whether the proposed explanation is simplistic or not. I find it obvious that more research is in order, and it appears most people commentating on this thread, if not all, are in agreement. I've enjoyed reading all the comments on this discussion! Now, back to "work". Glenn Corbiere Glenn Corbiere 100 Prospect St. Chester, MA. 01011-9657 www.dragonhunter.net ________________________________ From: Marion Dobbs To: Odonata-l Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 7:41:14 AM Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam This is straying even farther afield, but today's New York Times has a piece by Nicholas Kristof linking frog abnormalities, as well as those in other amphibians and in fish, to endocrine disruptors, a category of chemicals used in industry and agriculture and also found in some human waste. This sort of canary in the coal mine scenario is making scientists look at a possible connection between these same chemicals and increasing numbers of abnormalities in humans. Further evidence that larval odonates may be only one contributor to frog leg anomalies.   http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/28/opinion/28kristof.html   Marion Dobbs Rome (Floyd Co.) GA pond_damsel AT comcast.net http://mamomi.net http://mariondobbs.smugmug.com http://ponddamsel.phanfare.com   ----- Original Message ----- From: Richard Rowe To: John Acorn ; Odonata-l Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 9:49 PM Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam John Acorn wrote: Hi Josh, Odesters, Just a wee clarification, since I've been thinking about this myself.  Occam's Razor is a logical concept, not a scientific concept, and it fails to point to the "right answer" not because it is flawed logically, but because it needs sufficient evidence to work correctly.  It simply means choosing the hypothesis that makes the fewest poorly supported, or unsupported assumptions.  The only way to judge these assumptions is with evidence, so a more detailed view of the world makes for a more useful application of parsimony (i.e. Occam's Razor).  To ignore parsimony is to accept unnecessarily complex hypotheses, which is not a good idea either.  It all points not to the weakness of parsimony, but to the limits of science in the face of a very complex world.Precisely. And until you have evidence it is NOT predation you shouldn't seek more complicated explanations (the filmed predators look like libellulids, aeshnids chomp tadpoles but do a complete job, Pantala flavescens is a libellulid that chomps tadpoles, so choose your predator carefully). The seeking of complex explanations comes close to Crabtree's bludgeon (q.v.). On Jun 26, 2009, at 9:19 PM, Joshua Rose wrote: Occam's Razor actually tends to be wrong in many ecological cases. Academic science favors oversimplification; everyone wants to boil each effect down to a single cause, that being conducive to winning grants, getting published, and receiving tenure. Real life usually does not cooperate.in multivariate situations, and where synergistic processes abound, a little early observation can go a long way to asking the right questions. Asking the wrong question, and worse erecting a bandwagon based on the wrong question, does science no favours. The publications I read concerning that chytrid indicated that it had been present in many areas without causing any undue harm to amphibians; but that other environmental effects - acidification, UV, and so on - degraded the amphibian's immune responses such that the formerly innocuous chytrid became a threat. To the extent that herpetologists carried the chytrid to isolated populations and helped wipe them out, if that did take place, it was A cause but probably not THE cause. A number of frog populations disappeared that had been well known to herpetologists and under study for many years before the chytrid reared its ugly head.The chytrid in question had been out there for years before it was recognised as a problem, then identified as a previously unrecognised species that had invaded new habitats/species. From memory (treacherous) it was first identified on Dendrobates in the National Zoological Park in Washington DC. First publications were in 1999. Before that people were looking for complicated causes and ignored the fundamental indications of an infectious agent which would have led them to the correct diagnosis in the late 80s. Batrachochytrium dendrobatidis is not hard to find. Another study indicated that non-native Bullfrogs were carriers of the chytrid, hosting it but not being killed off by it, and had helped spread it to at least four continents. African Clawed Frogs are carriers as well. One more piece of the complicated puzzle. Back to the issue relevant to this listserv, the odonate larvae eating the legs off of amphibian larvae. The study in question took place in three ponds in one county in England. The answer may be simple in this one small area. There is a LOT more research to do before odonates can be generally accepted as a single worldwide cause of amphibian limb shortages.... -- Dr Richard Rowe Zoology & Tropical Ecology School of Marine & Tropical Biology James Cook University Townsville 4811 AUSTRALIA ph +61 7 47 81 4851 fax +61 7 47 25 1570 JCU has CRICOS Provider Code 00117J ________________________________ _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam From: "Marion Dobbs" <pond_damsel AT comcast.net> Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 07:41:14 -0400 This is straying even farther afield, but today's New York Times has a piece by Nicholas Kristof linking frog abnormalities, as well as those in other amphibians and in fish, to endocrine disruptors, a category of chemicals used in industry and agriculture and also found in some human waste. This sort of canary in the coal mine scenario is making scientists look at a possible connection between these same chemicals and increasing numbers of abnormalities in humans. Further evidence that larval odonates may be only one contributor to frog leg anomalies. http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/28/opinion/28kristof.html Marion Dobbs Rome (Floyd Co.) GA pond_damsel AT comcast.net http://mamomi.net http://mariondobbs.smugmug.com http://ponddamsel.phanfare.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Richard Rowe To: John Acorn ; Odonata-l Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 9:49 PM Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam John Acorn wrote: Hi Josh, Odesters, Just a wee clarification, since I've been thinking about this myself. Occam's Razor is a logical concept, not a scientific concept, and it fails to point to the "right answer" not because it is flawed logically, but because it needs sufficient evidence to work correctly. It simply means choosing the hypothesis that makes the fewest poorly supported, or unsupported assumptions. The only way to judge these assumptions is with evidence, so a more detailed view of the world makes for a more useful application of parsimony (i.e. Occam's Razor). To ignore parsimony is to accept unnecessarily complex hypotheses, which is not a good idea either. It all points not to the weakness of parsimony, but to the limits of science in the face of a very complex world. Precisely. And until you have evidence it is NOT predation you shouldn't seek more complicated explanations (the filmed predators look like libellulids, aeshnids chomp tadpoles but do a complete job, Pantala flavescens is a libellulid that chomps tadpoles, so choose your predator carefully). The seeking of complex explanations comes close to Crabtree's bludgeon (q.v.). On Jun 26, 2009, at 9:19 PM, Joshua Rose wrote: Occam's Razor actually tends to be wrong in many ecological cases. Academic science favors oversimplification; everyone wants to boil each effect down to a single cause, that being conducive to winning grants, getting published, and receiving tenure. Real life usually does not cooperate. in multivariate situations, and where synergistic processes abound, a little early observation can go a long way to asking the right questions. Asking the wrong question, and worse erecting a bandwagon based on the wrong question, does science no favours. The publications I read concerning that chytrid indicated that it had been present in many areas without causing any undue harm to amphibians; but that other environmental effects - acidification, UV, and so on - degraded the amphibian's immune responses such that the formerly innocuous chytrid became a threat. To the extent that herpetologists carried the chytrid to isolated populations and helped wipe them out, if that did take place, it was A cause but probably not THE cause. A number of frog populations disappeared that had been well known to herpetologists and under study for many years before the chytrid reared its ugly head. The chytrid in question had been out there for years before it was recognised as a problem, then identified as a previously unrecognised species that had invaded new habitats/species. From memory (treacherous) it was first identified on Dendrobates in the National Zoological Park in Washington DC. First publications were in 1999. Before that people were looking for complicated causes and ignored the fundamental indications of an infectious agent which would have led them to the correct diagnosis in the late 80s. Batrachochytrium dendrobatidis is not hard to find. Another study indicated that non-native Bullfrogs were carriers of the chytrid, hosting it but not being killed off by it, and had helped spread it to at least four continents. African Clawed Frogs are carriers as well. One more piece of the complicated puzzle. Back to the issue relevant to this listserv, the odonate larvae eating the legs off of amphibian larvae. The study in question took place in three ponds in one county in England. The answer may be simple in this one small area. There is a LOT more research to do before odonates can be generally accepted as a single worldwide cause of amphibian limb shortages.... -- Dr Richard Rowe Zoology & Tropical Ecology School of Marine & Tropical Biology James Cook University Townsville 4811 AUSTRALIA ph +61 7 47 81 4851 fax +61 7 47 25 1570 JCU has CRICOS Provider Code 00117J ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam From: Richard Rowe <richard.rowe AT jcu.edu.au> Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 11:49:41 +1000 _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: odonate photos needed From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 16:12:45 -0700 Hello, all. I still need quite a few photos for the eastern North American odonate field guide I'm writing. If anyone has good photos of any of these species/sexes, I would be forever grateful for the opportunity to use them. I have no photo budget, but you will get a free copy of the book when it is published if one or more of your photos are used. Also note that I can't include photos of these species in the book if I don't have them! And please consider this a hit list for the rest of the summer. My apologies for the cross-posting. ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net ODONATE PHOTOS NEEDED BY DENNIS PAULSON FOR EASTERN NORTH AMERICA ODONATA FIELD GUIDE - June 2009 Western Red Damsel Amphiagrion abbreviatum F plains River Bluet Enallagma anna F blue Northern Bluet Enallagma annexum F brown Familiar Bluet Enallagma civile F green Vernal Bluet Enallagma vernale F Caribbean Yellowface Neoerythromma cultellatum F Azure Darner Aeshna septentrionalis F Taper-tailed Darner Gomphaeschna antilope F Bayou Clubtail Arigomphus maxwelli F Gulf Coast Clubtail Gomphus modestus F Acuminate Snaketail Ophiogomphus acuminatus MF Southern Snaketail Ophiogomphus australis M St. Croix Snaketail Ophiogomphus susbehcha MF Westfall's Snaketail Ophiogomphus westfalli F Belle's Sanddragon Progomphus bellei F Brimstone Clubtail Stylurus intricatus F Shining Clubtail Stylurus ivae F Yellow-sided Clubtail Stylurus potulentus MF Zebra Clubtail Stylurus scudderi F Townes's Clubtail Stylurus townesi MF Tiger Spiketail Cordulegaster erronea F Robust Baskettail Epitheca spinosa F Alabama Shadowdragon Neurocordulia alabamensis F Cinnamon Shadowdragon Neurocordulia virginiensis F Quebec Emerald Somatochlora brevicincta MF Calvert's Emerald Somatochlora calverti M Lake Emerald Somatochlora cingulata F Plains Emerald Somatochlora ensigera MF Coppery Emerald Somatochlora georgiana F Hine's Emerald Somatochlora hineana F Hudsonian Emerald Somatochlora hudsonica F Texas Emerald Somatochlora margarita MF Ozark Emerald Somatochlora ozarkensis M Muskeg Emerald Somatochlora septentrionalis MF Purple Skimmer Libellula jesseana F Garnet Glider Tauriphila australis MF Sooty Saddlebags Tramea binotata F Antillean Saddlebags Tramea insularis F _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: odonate photos needed From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 16:12:45 -0700 Hello, all. I still need quite a few photos for the eastern North American odonate field guide I'm writing. If anyone has good photos of any of these species/sexes, I would be forever grateful for the opportunity to use them. I have no photo budget, but you will get a free copy of the book when it is published if one or more of your photos are used. Also note that I can't include photos of these species in the book if I don't have them! And please consider this a hit list for the rest of the summer. My apologies for the cross-posting. ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net ODONATE PHOTOS NEEDED BY DENNIS PAULSON FOR EASTERN NORTH AMERICA ODONATA FIELD GUIDE - June 2009 Western Red Damsel Amphiagrion abbreviatum F plains River Bluet Enallagma anna F blue Northern Bluet Enallagma annexum F brown Familiar Bluet Enallagma civile F green Vernal Bluet Enallagma vernale F Caribbean Yellowface Neoerythromma cultellatum F Azure Darner Aeshna septentrionalis F Taper-tailed Darner Gomphaeschna antilope F Bayou Clubtail Arigomphus maxwelli F Gulf Coast Clubtail Gomphus modestus F Acuminate Snaketail Ophiogomphus acuminatus MF Southern Snaketail Ophiogomphus australis M St. Croix Snaketail Ophiogomphus susbehcha MF Westfall's Snaketail Ophiogomphus westfalli F Belle's Sanddragon Progomphus bellei F Brimstone Clubtail Stylurus intricatus F Shining Clubtail Stylurus ivae F Yellow-sided Clubtail Stylurus potulentus MF Zebra Clubtail Stylurus scudderi F Townes's Clubtail Stylurus townesi MF Tiger Spiketail Cordulegaster erronea F Robust Baskettail Epitheca spinosa F Alabama Shadowdragon Neurocordulia alabamensis F Cinnamon Shadowdragon Neurocordulia virginiensis F Quebec Emerald Somatochlora brevicincta MF Calvert's Emerald Somatochlora calverti M Lake Emerald Somatochlora cingulata F Plains Emerald Somatochlora ensigera MF Coppery Emerald Somatochlora georgiana F Hine's Emerald Somatochlora hineana F Hudsonian Emerald Somatochlora hudsonica F Texas Emerald Somatochlora margarita MF Ozark Emerald Somatochlora ozarkensis M Muskeg Emerald Somatochlora septentrionalis MF Purple Skimmer Libellula jesseana F Garnet Glider Tauriphila australis MF Sooty Saddlebags Tramea binotata F Antillean Saddlebags Tramea insularis F Subject: odonate photos needed From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 16:12:45 -0700 Hello, all. I still need quite a few photos for the eastern North American odonate field guide I'm writing. If anyone has good photos of any of these species/sexes, I would be forever grateful for the opportunity to use them. I have no photo budget, but you will get a free copy of the book when it is published if one or more of your photos are used. Also note that I can't include photos of these species in the book if I don't have them! And please consider this a hit list for the rest of the summer. My apologies for the cross-posting. ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net ODONATE PHOTOS NEEDED BY DENNIS PAULSON FOR EASTERN NORTH AMERICA ODONATA FIELD GUIDE - June 2009 Western Red Damsel Amphiagrion abbreviatum F plains River Bluet Enallagma anna F blue Northern Bluet Enallagma annexum F brown Familiar Bluet Enallagma civile F green Vernal Bluet Enallagma vernale F Caribbean Yellowface Neoerythromma cultellatum F Azure Darner Aeshna septentrionalis F Taper-tailed Darner Gomphaeschna antilope F Bayou Clubtail Arigomphus maxwelli F Gulf Coast Clubtail Gomphus modestus F Acuminate Snaketail Ophiogomphus acuminatus MF Southern Snaketail Ophiogomphus australis M St. Croix Snaketail Ophiogomphus susbehcha MF Westfall's Snaketail Ophiogomphus westfalli F Belle's Sanddragon Progomphus bellei F Brimstone Clubtail Stylurus intricatus F Shining Clubtail Stylurus ivae F Yellow-sided Clubtail Stylurus potulentus MF Zebra Clubtail Stylurus scudderi F Townes's Clubtail Stylurus townesi MF Tiger Spiketail Cordulegaster erronea F Robust Baskettail Epitheca spinosa F Alabama Shadowdragon Neurocordulia alabamensis F Cinnamon Shadowdragon Neurocordulia virginiensis F Quebec Emerald Somatochlora brevicincta MF Calvert's Emerald Somatochlora calverti M Lake Emerald Somatochlora cingulata F Plains Emerald Somatochlora ensigera MF Coppery Emerald Somatochlora georgiana F Hine's Emerald Somatochlora hineana F Hudsonian Emerald Somatochlora hudsonica F Texas Emerald Somatochlora margarita MF Ozark Emerald Somatochlora ozarkensis M Muskeg Emerald Somatochlora septentrionalis MF Purple Skimmer Libellula jesseana F Garnet Glider Tauriphila australis MF Sooty Saddlebags Tramea binotata F Antillean Saddlebags Tramea insularis F Subject: odonate photos needed From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 16:12:45 -0700 Hello, all. I still need quite a few photos for the eastern North American odonate field guide I'm writing. If anyone has good photos of any of these species/sexes, I would be forever grateful for the opportunity to use them. I have no photo budget, but you will get a free copy of the book when it is published if one or more of your photos are used. Also note that I can't include photos of these species in the book if I don't have them! And please consider this a hit list for the rest of the summer. My apologies for the cross-posting. ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net ODONATE PHOTOS NEEDED BY DENNIS PAULSON FOR EASTERN NORTH AMERICA ODONATA FIELD GUIDE - June 2009 Western Red Damsel Amphiagrion abbreviatum F plains River Bluet Enallagma anna F blue Northern Bluet Enallagma annexum F brown Familiar Bluet Enallagma civile F green Vernal Bluet Enallagma vernale F Caribbean Yellowface Neoerythromma cultellatum F Azure Darner Aeshna septentrionalis F Taper-tailed Darner Gomphaeschna antilope F Bayou Clubtail Arigomphus maxwelli F Gulf Coast Clubtail Gomphus modestus F Acuminate Snaketail Ophiogomphus acuminatus MF Southern Snaketail Ophiogomphus australis M St. Croix Snaketail Ophiogomphus susbehcha MF Westfall's Snaketail Ophiogomphus westfalli F Belle's Sanddragon Progomphus bellei F Brimstone Clubtail Stylurus intricatus F Shining Clubtail Stylurus ivae F Yellow-sided Clubtail Stylurus potulentus MF Zebra Clubtail Stylurus scudderi F Townes's Clubtail Stylurus townesi MF Tiger Spiketail Cordulegaster erronea F Robust Baskettail Epitheca spinosa F Alabama Shadowdragon Neurocordulia alabamensis F Cinnamon Shadowdragon Neurocordulia virginiensis F Quebec Emerald Somatochlora brevicincta MF Calvert's Emerald Somatochlora calverti M Lake Emerald Somatochlora cingulata F Plains Emerald Somatochlora ensigera MF Coppery Emerald Somatochlora georgiana F Hine's Emerald Somatochlora hineana F Hudsonian Emerald Somatochlora hudsonica F Texas Emerald Somatochlora margarita MF Ozark Emerald Somatochlora ozarkensis M Muskeg Emerald Somatochlora septentrionalis MF Purple Skimmer Libellula jesseana F Garnet Glider Tauriphila australis MF Sooty Saddlebags Tramea binotata F Antillean Saddlebags Tramea insularis F Subject: odonate photos needed From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 16:12:45 -0700 Hello, all. I still need quite a few photos for the eastern North American odonate field guide I'm writing. If anyone has good photos of any of these species/sexes, I would be forever grateful for the opportunity to use them. I have no photo budget, but you will get a free copy of the book when it is published if one or more of your photos are used. Also note that I can't include photos of these species in the book if I don't have them! And please consider this a hit list for the rest of the summer. My apologies for the cross-posting. ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net ODONATE PHOTOS NEEDED BY DENNIS PAULSON FOR EASTERN NORTH AMERICA ODONATA FIELD GUIDE - June 2009 Western Red Damsel Amphiagrion abbreviatum F plains River Bluet Enallagma anna F blue Northern Bluet Enallagma annexum F brown Familiar Bluet Enallagma civile F green Vernal Bluet Enallagma vernale F Caribbean Yellowface Neoerythromma cultellatum F Azure Darner Aeshna septentrionalis F Taper-tailed Darner Gomphaeschna antilope F Bayou Clubtail Arigomphus maxwelli F Gulf Coast Clubtail Gomphus modestus F Acuminate Snaketail Ophiogomphus acuminatus MF Southern Snaketail Ophiogomphus australis M St. Croix Snaketail Ophiogomphus susbehcha MF Westfall's Snaketail Ophiogomphus westfalli F Belle's Sanddragon Progomphus bellei F Brimstone Clubtail Stylurus intricatus F Shining Clubtail Stylurus ivae F Yellow-sided Clubtail Stylurus potulentus MF Zebra Clubtail Stylurus scudderi F Townes's Clubtail Stylurus townesi MF Tiger Spiketail Cordulegaster erronea F Robust Baskettail Epitheca spinosa F Alabama Shadowdragon Neurocordulia alabamensis F Cinnamon Shadowdragon Neurocordulia virginiensis F Quebec Emerald Somatochlora brevicincta MF Calvert's Emerald Somatochlora calverti M Lake Emerald Somatochlora cingulata F Plains Emerald Somatochlora ensigera MF Coppery Emerald Somatochlora georgiana F Hine's Emerald Somatochlora hineana F Hudsonian Emerald Somatochlora hudsonica F Texas Emerald Somatochlora margarita MF Ozark Emerald Somatochlora ozarkensis M Muskeg Emerald Somatochlora septentrionalis MF Purple Skimmer Libellula jesseana F Garnet Glider Tauriphila australis MF Sooty Saddlebags Tramea binotata F Antillean Saddlebags Tramea insularis F [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Subject: odonate photos needed From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 16:12:45 -0700 Hello, all. I still need quite a few photos for the eastern North American odonate field guide I'm writing. If anyone has good photos of any of these species/sexes, I would be forever grateful for the opportunity to use them. I have no photo budget, but you will get a free copy of the book when it is published if one or more of your photos are used. Also note that I can't include photos of these species in the book if I don't have them! And please consider this a hit list for the rest of the summer. My apologies for the cross-posting. ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net ODONATE PHOTOS NEEDED BY DENNIS PAULSON FOR EASTERN NORTH AMERICA ODONATA FIELD GUIDE - June 2009 Western Red Damsel Amphiagrion abbreviatum F plains River Bluet Enallagma anna F blue Northern Bluet Enallagma annexum F brown Familiar Bluet Enallagma civile F green Vernal Bluet Enallagma vernale F Caribbean Yellowface Neoerythromma cultellatum F Azure Darner Aeshna septentrionalis F Taper-tailed Darner Gomphaeschna antilope F Bayou Clubtail Arigomphus maxwelli F Gulf Coast Clubtail Gomphus modestus F Acuminate Snaketail Ophiogomphus acuminatus MF Southern Snaketail Ophiogomphus australis M St. Croix Snaketail Ophiogomphus susbehcha MF Westfall's Snaketail Ophiogomphus westfalli F Belle's Sanddragon Progomphus bellei F Brimstone Clubtail Stylurus intricatus F Shining Clubtail Stylurus ivae F Yellow-sided Clubtail Stylurus potulentus MF Zebra Clubtail Stylurus scudderi F Townes's Clubtail Stylurus townesi MF Tiger Spiketail Cordulegaster erronea F Robust Baskettail Epitheca spinosa F Alabama Shadowdragon Neurocordulia alabamensis F Cinnamon Shadowdragon Neurocordulia virginiensis F Quebec Emerald Somatochlora brevicincta MF Calvert's Emerald Somatochlora calverti M Lake Emerald Somatochlora cingulata F Plains Emerald Somatochlora ensigera MF Coppery Emerald Somatochlora georgiana F Hine's Emerald Somatochlora hineana F Hudsonian Emerald Somatochlora hudsonica F Texas Emerald Somatochlora margarita MF Ozark Emerald Somatochlora ozarkensis M Muskeg Emerald Somatochlora septentrionalis MF Purple Skimmer Libellula jesseana F Garnet Glider Tauriphila australis MF Sooty Saddlebags Tramea binotata F Antillean Saddlebags Tramea insularis F Subject: Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam From: John Acorn <janature AT compusmart.ab.ca> Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 07:25:19 -0600 Hi Odesters, It is unusual for me to post to this list twice in one day, after lurking for months, but here goes. I enjoyed Hooper's book as well, but very quickly discovered that many of my colleagues did not. In particular, my friend the late Michael Majerus, of Cambridge, went to great lengths to undo what he saw as the damage created by Hooper's biologically-naive criticisms of industrial melanism. He did not live to see his rebuttal, based on new experiments with the peppered moth, in print, but his talk on the subject can be downloaded at http://www.gen.cam.ac.uk/Research/majerus.htm The crux of the problem is that anti-evolutionists have used Hooper's book as ammunition. Do read the book, but also read the criticisms. The controversy is summarized on Wikipedia at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Of_Moths_and_Men John Acorn Edmonton, Alberta On Jun 26, 2009, at 11:11 PM, Dave Small wrote: > I second Glenn's recommendation of "Of Moths and Men" A wonderful > true story account of the Politics of Science. It was at a Focus > Outdoors Conference (circa 1970) sponsored by Mass Audubon that I > first heard Ted Sergeant speak about his Underwing Moths! A new use > for dad's underutilized Beer as baiting Moths became just another > thing a country kid did to keep himself amused... Tonight's moth > Blog, A new medium I am trying out for the first time, can be found > at: http://dhsmall.blogspot.com/ > > As for the Odonate predation on larval frog legs, I found the story > to be most interesting. Correctly pointed out is the fact this study > took place at 3 ponds in England... It would be inappropriateto > extrapolate this causal effect too broadly. It is just another piece > of this wonderful puzzle we call nature.. I kind of hope we never > totally understand it... What fun would that be? > > Dave Small > Athol, Massachusetts > dave AT dhsmall.net > www.dhsmall.net > 978-413-1772 > -----Original Message----- > From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu > ]On Behalf Of Glenn Corbiere > Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 12:32 AM > To: Joshua Rose; Odonata-l > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer > - Occam > > One of my favorite accounts of oversimplification, and as a > reviewer, and not just any reviewer, Ernst Mayr, commented, "a > fascinating account of many, many years of observation and > experimentation - and of traps" is a book by Judith Hooper (who also > happens to be from Amherst) called "Of Moths and Men - The Untold > Story of Science and the Peppered Moth" It is simply a joy to read > if you love science, bugs, and just plain great storys. Oh, quite a > bit of this book is about another local scholar, one Theodore D. > Sargent, author of the difficult to find work, "Legion of Night - > The Underwing Moths" > Trust me on this one - get a copy of "Of Moths and Men". You'll > love it. > > Glenn > > > Glenn Corbiere > 100 Prospect St. > Chester, MA. 01011-9657 > > www.dragonhunter.net > > > From: Joshua Rose > To: Odonata-l > Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 11:19:47 PM > Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer > - Occam > > Occam's Razor actually tends to be wrong in many ecological cases. > Academic science favors oversimplification; everyone wants to boil > each effect down to a single cause, that being conducive to winning > grants, getting published, and receiving tenure. Real life usually > does not cooperate. > > The publications I read concerning that chytrid indicated that it > had been present in many areas without causing any undue harm to > amphibians; but that other environmental effects - acidification, > UV, and so on - degraded the amphibian's immune responses such that > the formerly innocuous chytrid became a threat. To the extent that > herpetologists carried the chytrid to isolated populations and > helped wipe them out, if that did take place, it was A cause but > probably not THE cause. A number of frog populations disappeared > that had been well known to herpetologists and under study for many > years before the chytrid reared its ugly head. > > Another study indicated that non-native Bullfrogs were carriers of > the chytrid, hosting it but not being killed off by it, and had > helped spread it to at least four continents. African Clawed Frogs > are carriers as well. One more piece of the complicated puzzle. > > Back to the issue relevant to this listserv, the odonate larvae > eating the legs off of amphibian larvae. The study in question took > place in three ponds in one county in England. The answer may be > simple in this one small area. There is a LOT more research to do > before odonates can be generally accepted as a single worldwide > cause of amphibian limb shortages.... > > Josh Rose, Ph.D. > McAllen TX (but soon relocating to Amherst MA) > > On Jun 26, 2009, at 8:38 PM, Richard Rowe wrote: > >> Occam says 'go with predation' ... it is the simplest solution and >> seems consistent with the scope and scale of the data. The >> herpetology crowd have been very well funded on the basis of dire, >> apocalyptic warnings revolving about 'canaries in coal mines'. The >> 'vanishing frogs' events weren't because the system was collapsing >> or UV radiation on mountain tops but due to a pandemic of an >> invasive chytrid, most likely vectored by herpetologists; the >> multilegs wasn't due to unspecified trace toxins but to a well- >> recognised parasite ... By looking for exotic solutions they have >> actually endangered their study animals. In Australia there was a >> decade of discovering new and pristine habitats with healthy >> populations of frogs, only for the frogs to go bust at the next >> visit while everything else was doing just fine. Making haste >> slowly could have been well worthwhile and saved a lot of frogs. >> >> I think we should sit with Occam until it is shown that some more >> exotic solution is necessary. >> >> Lawson, Tamara wrote: > >>> This article is misleading as it makes the “answer” sound >>> simplistic at best. My husband is a herpetologist (although he >>> prefers to study snakes) and I’ve occasionally gone to meetings >>> with him and sat in on some of the presentations. The >>> overwhelming thought of most herpetologists that I’ve talked to >>> (and Nova had a program on amphibians recently as well that stated >>> this idea) is that THERE IS NO SINGLE CAUSE for the mutations (as >>> well as the deaths) observed in amphibians. Research as shown >>> that some chemicals (this includes man-made ones as well as some >>> secreted by plants’ roots), some parasites (some worms, some >>> fungi, as well as single-celled species, etc.), and some >>> environmental factors (temperature extremes, salinity, predators, >>> etc.) all contribute to current problem of amphibian deformities. >>> The cause for the world-wide problem is just different in >>> different bodies of water with some research showing multiple >>> cumulative causes and even additive causes in the same pond. It >>> all goes back to the old saying (or it should be a saying) “don’t >>> look for simple answers in a complicated system”. >>> >>> Tamara Lawson, Science Lab. Manager >>> >>> From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu >>> ] On Behalf Of Michael Blust >>> Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 9:10 AM >>> To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu >>> Subject: [Odonata-l] Frog legs and odonates - attempt #2 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Legless Frogs Mystery Solved >>> >>> from BBC News Online >>> >>> Scientists think they have resolved one of the most controversial >>> environmental issues of the past decade: the curious case of the >>> missing frogs' legs. >>> >>> Around the world, frogs are found with missing or misshaped limbs, >>> a striking deformity that many researchers believe is caused by >>> chemical pollution. >>> >>> However, tests on frogs and toads have revealed a more natural, >>> benign cause. The deformed frogs are actually victims of the >>> predatory habits of dragonfly nymphs, which eat the legs of >>> tadpoles. >>> >>> http://snipr.com/kx70t >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------ >>> Michael Blust >>> Dept. of Natural Science >>> Green Mountain College >>> Poultney, VT 05764 >>> 802-287-8331 >>> blustm AT greenmtn.edu >>> >>> >> >> -- >> Dr Richard Rowe >> Zoology & Tropical Ecology >> School of Marine & Tropical Biology >> James Cook University >> Townsville 4811 >> AUSTRALIA >> >> ph +61 7 47 81 4851 >> fax +61 7 47 25 1570 >> JCU has CRICOS Provider Code 00117J > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam From: John Acorn <janature AT compusmart.ab.ca> Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 07:14:34 -0600 Hi Josh, Odesters, Just a wee clarification, since I've been thinking about this myself. Occam's Razor is a logical concept, not a scientific concept, and it fails to point to the "right answer" not because it is flawed logically, but because it needs sufficient evidence to work correctly. It simply means choosing the hypothesis that makes the fewest poorly supported, or unsupported assumptions. The only way to judge these assumptions is with evidence, so a more detailed view of the world makes for a more useful application of parsimony (i.e. Occam's Razor). To ignore parsimony is to accept unnecessarily complex hypotheses, which is not a good idea either. It all points not to the weakness of parsimony, but to the limits of science in the face of a very complex world. And Josh, I guess I won't have another opportunity to prowl around south Texas with you-- hope your move to Amherst brings all good things! John Acorn Edmonton, Alberta On Jun 26, 2009, at 9:19 PM, Joshua Rose wrote: > Occam's Razor actually tends to be wrong in many ecological cases. > Academic science favors oversimplification; everyone wants to boil > each effect down to a single cause, that being conducive to winning > grants, getting published, and receiving tenure. Real life usually > does not cooperate. > > The publications I read concerning that chytrid indicated that it > had been present in many areas without causing any undue harm to > amphibians; but that other environmental effects - acidification, > UV, and so on - degraded the amphibian's immune responses such that > the formerly innocuous chytrid became a threat. To the extent that > herpetologists carried the chytrid to isolated populations and > helped wipe them out, if that did take place, it was A cause but > probably not THE cause. A number of frog populations disappeared > that had been well known to herpetologists and under study for many > years before the chytrid reared its ugly head. > > Another study indicated that non-native Bullfrogs were carriers of > the chytrid, hosting it but not being killed off by it, and had > helped spread it to at least four continents. African Clawed Frogs > are carriers as well. One more piece of the complicated puzzle. > > Back to the issue relevant to this listserv, the odonate larvae > eating the legs off of amphibian larvae. The study in question took > place in three ponds in one county in England. The answer may be > simple in this one small area. There is a LOT more research to do > before odonates can be generally accepted as a single worldwide > cause of amphibian limb shortages.... > > Josh Rose, Ph.D. > McAllen TX (but soon relocating to Amherst MA) > > On Jun 26, 2009, at 8:38 PM, Richard Rowe wrote: > >> Occam says 'go with predation' ... it is the simplest solution and >> seems consistent with the scope and scale of the data. The >> herpetology crowd have been very well funded on the basis of dire, >> apocalyptic warnings revolving about 'canaries in coal mines'. The >> 'vanishing frogs' events weren't because the system was collapsing >> or UV radiation on mountain tops but due to a pandemic of an >> invasive chytrid, most likely vectored by herpetologists; the >> multilegs wasn't due to unspecified trace toxins but to a well- >> recognised parasite ... By looking for exotic solutions they have >> actually endangered their study animals. In Australia there was a >> decade of discovering new and pristine habitats with healthy >> populations of frogs, only for the frogs to go bust at the next >> visit while everything else was doing just fine. Making haste >> slowly could have been well worthwhile and saved a lot of frogs. >> >> I think we should sit with Occam until it is shown that some more >> exotic solution is necessary. >> >> Lawson, Tamara wrote: > >>> This article is misleading as it makes the “answer” sound >>> simplistic at best. My husband is a herpetologist (although he >>> prefers to study snakes) and I’ve occasionally gone to meetings >>> with him and sat in on some of the presentations. The >>> overwhelming thought of most herpetologists that I’ve talked to >>> (and Nova had a program on amphibians recently as well that stated >>> this idea) is that THERE IS NO SINGLE CAUSE for the mutations (as >>> well as the deaths) observed in amphibians. Research as shown >>> that some chemicals (this includes man-made ones as well as some >>> secreted by plants’ roots), some parasites (some worms, some >>> fungi, as well as single-celled species, etc.), and some >>> environmental factors (temperature extremes, salinity, predators, >>> etc.) all contribute to current problem of amphibian deformities. >>> The cause for the world-wide problem is just different in >>> different bodies of water with some research showing multiple >>> cumulative causes and even additive causes in the same pond. It >>> all goes back to the old saying (or it should be a saying) “don’t >>> look for simple answers in a complicated system”. >>> >>> Tamara Lawson, Science Lab. Manager >>> >>> From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu >>> ] On Behalf Of Michael Blust >>> Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 9:10 AM >>> To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu >>> Subject: [Odonata-l] Frog legs and odonates - attempt #2 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Legless Frogs Mystery Solved >>> >>> from BBC News Online >>> >>> Scientists think they have resolved one of the most controversial >>> environmental issues of the past decade: the curious case of the >>> missing frogs' legs. >>> >>> Around the world, frogs are found with missing or misshaped limbs, >>> a striking deformity that many researchers believe is caused by >>> chemical pollution. >>> >>> However, tests on frogs and toads have revealed a more natural, >>> benign cause. The deformed frogs are actually victims of the >>> predatory habits of dragonfly nymphs, which eat the legs of >>> tadpoles. >>> >>> http://snipr.com/kx70t >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------ >>> Michael Blust >>> Dept. of Natural Science >>> Green Mountain College >>> Poultney, VT 05764 >>> 802-287-8331 >>> blustm AT greenmtn.edu >>> >>> >> >> -- >> Dr Richard Rowe >> Zoology & Tropical Ecology >> School of Marine & Tropical Biology >> James Cook University >> Townsville 4811 >> AUSTRALIA >> >> ph +61 7 47 81 4851 >> fax +61 7 47 25 1570 >> JCU has CRICOS Provider Code 00117J > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam From: "Dave Small" <Dave AT dhsmall.net> Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 01:11:43 -0400 I second Glenn's recommendation of "Of Moths and Men" A wonderful true story account of the Politics of Science. It was at a Focus Outdoors Conference (circa 1970) sponsored by Mass Audubon that I first heard Ted Sergeant speak about his Underwing Moths! A new use for dad's underutilized Beer as baiting Moths became just another thing a country kid did to keep himself amused... Tonight's moth Blog, A new medium I am trying out for the first time, can be found at: http://dhsmall.blogspot.com/ As for the Odonate predation on larval frog legs, I found the story to be most interesting. Correctly pointed out is the fact this study took place at 3 ponds in England... It would be inappropriate to extrapolate this causal effect too broadly. It is just another piece of this wonderful puzzle we call nature.. I kind of hope we never totally understand it... What fun would that be? Dave Small Athol, Massachusetts dave AT dhsmall.net www.dhsmall.net 978-413-1772 -----Original Message----- From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu]On Behalf Of Glenn Corbiere Sent: Saturday, June 27, 2009 12:32 AM To: Joshua Rose; Odonata-l Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam One of my favorite accounts of oversimplification, and as a reviewer, and not just any reviewer, Ernst Mayr, commented, "a fascinating account of many, many years of observation and experimentation - and of traps" is a book by Judith Hooper (who also happens to be from Amherst) called "Of Moths and Men - The Untold Story of Science and the Peppered Moth" It is simply a joy to read if you love science, bugs, and just plain great storys. Oh, quite a bit of this book is about another local scholar, one Theodore D. Sargent, author of the difficult to find work, "Legion of Night - The Underwing Moths" Trust me on this one - get a copy of "Of Moths and Men". You'll love it. Glenn Glenn Corbiere 100 Prospect St. Chester, MA. 01011-9657 www.dragonhunter.net ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ From: Joshua Rose To: Odonata-l Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 11:19:47 PM Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam Occam's Razor actually tends to be wrong in many ecological cases. Academic science favors oversimplification; everyone wants to boil each effect down to a single cause, that being conducive to winning grants, getting published, and receiving tenure. Real life usually does not cooperate. The publications I read concerning that chytrid indicated that it had been present in many areas without causing any undue harm to amphibians; but that other environmental effects - acidification, UV, and so on - degraded the amphibian's immune responses such that the formerly innocuous chytrid became a threat. To the extent that herpetologists carried the chytrid to isolated populations and helped wipe them out, if that did take place, it was A cause but probably not THE cause. A number of frog populations disappeared that had been well known to herpetologists and under study for many years before the chytrid reared its ugly head. Another study indicated that non-native Bullfrogs were carriers of the chytrid, hosting it but not being killed off by it, and had helped spread it to at least four continents. African Clawed Frogs are carriers as well. One more piece of the complicated puzzle. Back to the issue relevant to this listserv, the odonate larvae eating the legs off of amphibian larvae. The study in question took place in three ponds in one county in England. The answer may be simple in this one small area. There is a LOT more research to do before odonates can be generally accepted as a single worldwide cause of amphibian limb shortages.... Josh Rose, Ph.D. McAllen TX (but soon relocating to Amherst MA) On Jun 26, 2009, at 8:38 PM, Richard Rowe wrote: Occam says 'go with predation' ... it is the simplest solution and seems consistent with the scope and scale of the data. The herpetology crowd have been very well funded on the basis of dire, apocalyptic warnings revolving about 'canaries in coal mines'. The 'vanishing frogs' events weren't because the system was collapsing or UV radiation on mountain tops but due to a pandemic of an invasive chytrid, most likely vectored by herpetologists; the multilegs wasn't due to unspecified trace toxins but to a well-recognised parasite ... By looking for exotic solutions they have actually endangered their study animals. In Australia there was a decade of discovering new and pristine habitats with healthy populations of frogs, only for the frogs to go bust at the next visit while everything else was doing just fine. Making haste slowly could have been well worthwhile and saved a lot of frogs. I think we should sit with Occam until it is shown that some more exotic solution is necessary. Lawson, Tamara wrote: This article is misleading as it makes the “answerâ€� sound simplistic at best. My husband is a herpetologist (although he prefers to study snakes) and I’ve occasionally gone to meetings with him and sat in on some of the presentations. The overwhelming thought of most herpetologists that I’ve talked to (and Nova had a program on amphibians recently as well that stated this idea) is that THERE IS NO SINGLE CAUSE for the mutations (as well as the deaths) observed in amphibians. Research as shown that some chemicals (this includes man-made ones as well as some secreted by plants’ roots), some parasites (some worms, some fungi, as well as single-celled species, etc.), and some environmental factors (temperature extremes, salinity, predators, etc.) all contribute to current problem of amphibian deformities. The cause for the world-wide problem is just different in different bodies of water with some research showing multiple cumulative causes and even additive causes in the same pond. It all goes back to the old saying (or it should be a saying) “don’t look for simple answers in a complicated systemâ€�. Tamara Lawson, Science Lab. Manager -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Michael Blust Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 9:10 AM To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Subject: [Odonata-l] Frog legs and odonates - attempt #2 Legless Frogs Mystery Solved from BBC News Online Scientists think they have resolved one of the most controversial environmental issues of the past decade: the curious case of the missing frogs' legs. Around the world, frogs are found with missing or misshaped limbs, a striking deformity that many researchers believe is caused by chemical pollution. However, tests on frogs and toads have revealed a more natural, benign cause. The deformed frogs are actually victims of the predatory habits of dragonfly nymphs, which eat the legs of tadpoles. http://snipr.com/kx70t ------------------------------------------------------------ Michael Blust Dept. of Natural Science Green Mountain College Poultney, VT 05764 802-287-8331 blustm AT greenmtn.edu -------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Dr Richard Rowe Zoology & Tropical Ecology School of Marine & Tropical Biology James Cook University Townsville 4811 AUSTRALIA ph +61 7 47 81 4851 fax +61 7 47 25 1570 JCU has CRICOS Provider Code 00117J _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam From: Glenn Corbiere <gcorbiere AT dragonhunter.net> Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 21:31:33 -0700 (PDT) One of my favorite accounts of oversimplification, and as a reviewer, and not just any reviewer, Ernst Mayr, commented, "a fascinating account of many, many years of observation and experimentation - and of traps" is a book by Judith Hooper (who also happens to be from Amherst) called "Of Moths and Men - The Untold Story of Science and the Peppered Moth" It is simply a joy to read if you love science, bugs, and just plain great storys. Oh, quite a bit of this book is about another local scholar, one Theodore D. Sargent, author of the difficult to find work, "Legion of Night - The Underwing Moths" Trust me on this one - get a copy of "Of Moths and Men".  You'll love it. Glenn Glenn Corbiere 100 Prospect St. Chester, MA. 01011-9657 www.dragonhunter.net ________________________________ From: Joshua Rose To: Odonata-l Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 11:19:47 PM Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam Occam's Razor actually tends to be wrong in many ecological cases. Academic science favors oversimplification; everyone wants to boil each effect down to a single cause, that being conducive to winning grants, getting published, and receiving tenure. Real life usually does not cooperate. The publications I read concerning that chytrid indicated that it had been present in many areas without causing any undue harm to amphibians; but that other environmental effects - acidification, UV, and so on - degraded the amphibian's immune responses such that the formerly innocuous chytrid became a threat. To the extent that herpetologists carried the chytrid to isolated populations and helped wipe them out, if that did take place, it was A cause but probably not THE cause. A number of frog populations disappeared that had been well known to herpetologists and under study for many years before the chytrid reared its ugly head. Another study indicated that non-native Bullfrogs were carriers of the chytrid, hosting it but not being killed off by it, and had helped spread it to at least four continents. African Clawed Frogs are carriers as well. One more piece of the complicated puzzle. Back to the issue relevant to this listserv, the odonate larvae eating the legs off of amphibian larvae. The study in question took place in three ponds in one county in England. The answer may be simple in this one small area. There is a LOT more research to do before odonates can be generally accepted as a single worldwide cause of amphibian limb shortages.... Josh Rose, Ph.D. McAllen TX (but soon relocating to Amherst MA) On Jun 26, 2009, at 8:38 PM, Richard Rowe wrote: Occam says 'go with predation' ... it is the simplest solution and seems consistent with the scope and scale of the data. The herpetology crowd have been very well funded on the basis of dire, apocalyptic warnings revolving about 'canaries in coal mines'. The 'vanishing frogs' events weren't because the system was collapsing or UV radiation on mountain tops but due to a pandemic of an invasive chytrid, most likely vectored by herpetologists; the multilegs wasn't due to unspecified trace toxins but to a well-recognised parasite ... By looking for exotic solutions they have actually endangered their study animals. In Australia there was a decade of discovering new and pristine habitats with healthy populations of frogs, only for the frogs to go bust at the next visit while everything else was doing just fine. Making haste slowly could have been well worthwhile and saved a lot of frogs. I think we should sit with Occam until it is shown that some more exotic solution is necessary. Lawson, Tamara wrote: This article is misleading as it makes the “answerâ€� sound simplistic at best.  My husband is a herpetologist (although he prefers to study snakes) and I’ve occasionally gone to meetings with him and sat in on some of the presentations.  The overwhelming thought of most herpetologists that I’ve talked to (and Nova had a program on amphibians recently as well that stated this idea) is that THERE IS NO SINGLE CAUSE for the mutations (as well as the deaths) observed in amphibians.  Research as shown that some chemicals (this includes man-made ones as well as some secreted by plants’ roots), some parasites (some worms, some fungi, as well as single-celled species, etc.), and some environmental factors (temperature extremes, salinity, predators, etc.) all contribute to current problem of amphibian deformities.  The cause for the world-wide problem is just different in different bodies of water with some research showing multiple cumulative causes and even additive causes in the same pond.  It all goes back to the old saying (or it should be a saying) “don’t look for simple answers in a complicated systemâ€�.   Tamara Lawson, Science Lab. Manager   ________________________________ From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Michael Blust Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 9:10 AM To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Subject: [Odonata-l] Frog legs and odonates - attempt #2     Legless Frogs Mystery Solved from BBC News Online Scientists think they have resolved one of the most controversial environmental issues of the past decade: the curious case of the missing frogs' legs. Around the world, frogs are found with missing or misshaped limbs, a striking deformity that many researchers believe is caused by chemical pollution. However, tests on frogs and toads have revealed a more natural, benign cause. The deformed frogs are actually victims of the predatory habits of dragonfly nymphs, which eat the legs of tadpoles. http://snipr.com/kx70t ------------------------------------------------------------ Michael Blust Dept. of Natural Science Green Mountain College Poultney, VT   05764 802-287-8331 blustm AT greenmtn.edu   ________________________________ -- Dr Richard Rowe Zoology & Tropical Ecology School of Marine & Tropical Biology James Cook University Townsville 4811 AUSTRALIA ph +61 7 47 81 4851 fax +61 7 47 25 1570 JCU has CRICOS Provider Code 00117J _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam From: Joshua Rose <opihi AT rgv.rr.com> Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 22:19:47 -0500 Occam's Razor actually tends to be wrong in many ecological cases. Academic science favors oversimplification; everyone wants to boil each effect down to a single cause, that being conducive to winning grants, getting published, and receiving tenure. Real life usually does not cooperate. The publications I read concerning that chytrid indicated that it had been present in many areas without causing any undue harm to amphibians; but that other environmental effects - acidification, UV, and so on - degraded the amphibian's immune responses such that the formerly innocuous chytrid became a threat. To the extent that herpetologists carried the chytrid to isolated populations and helped wipe them out, if that did take place, it was A cause but probably not THE cause. A number of frog populations disappeared that had been well known to herpetologists and under study for many years before the chytrid reared its ugly head. Another study indicated that non-native Bullfrogs were carriers of the chytrid, hosting it but not being killed off by it, and had helped spread it to at least four continents. African Clawed Frogs are carriers as well. One more piece of the complicated puzzle. Back to the issue relevant to this listserv, the odonate larvae eating the legs off of amphibian larvae. The study in question took place in three ponds in one county in England. The answer may be simple in this one small area. There is a LOT more research to do before odonates can be generally accepted as a single worldwide cause of amphibian limb shortages.... Josh Rose, Ph.D. McAllen TX (but soon relocating to Amherst MA) On Jun 26, 2009, at 8:38 PM, Richard Rowe wrote: > Occam says 'go with predation' ... it is the simplest solution and > seems consistent with the scope and scale of the data. The > herpetology crowd have been very well funded on the basis of dire, > apocalyptic warnings revolving about 'canaries in coal mines'. The > 'vanishing frogs' events weren't because the system was collapsing > or UV radiation on mountain tops but due to a pandemic of an > invasive chytrid, most likely vectored by herpetologists; the > multilegs wasn't due to unspecified trace toxins but to a well- > recognised parasite ... By looking for exotic solutions they have > actually endangered their study animals. In Australia there was a > decade of discovering new and pristine habitats with healthy > populations of frogs, only for the frogs to go bust at the next > visit while everything else was doing just fine. Making haste slowly > could have been well worthwhile and saved a lot of frogs. > > I think we should sit with Occam until it is shown that some more > exotic solution is necessary. > > Lawson, Tamara wrote: >> This article is misleading as it makes the “answer” sound >> simplistic at best. My husband is a herpetologist (although he >> prefers to study snakes) and I’ve occasionally gone to meetings >> with him and sat in on some of the presentations. The overwhelming >> thought of most herpetologists that I’ve talked to (and Nova had a >> program on amphibians recently as well that stated this idea) is >> that THERE IS NO SINGLE CAUSE for the mutations (as well as the >> deaths) observed in amphibians. Research as shown that some >> chemicals (this includes man-made ones as well as some secreted by >> plants’ roots), some parasites (some worms, some fungi, as well as >> single-celled species, etc.), and some environmental factors >> (temperature extremes, salinity, predators, etc.) all contribute to >> current problem of amphibian deformities. The cause for the world- >> wide problem is just different in different bodies of water with >> some research showing multiple cumulative causes and even additive >> causes in the same pond. It all goes back to the old saying (or it >> should be a saying) “don’t look for simple answers in a complicated >> system”. >> >> Tamara Lawson, Science Lab. Manager >> >> From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu >> ] On Behalf Of Michael Blust >> Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 9:10 AM >> To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu >> Subject: [Odonata-l] Frog legs and odonates - attempt #2 >> >> >> >> >> Legless Frogs Mystery Solved >> >> from BBC News Online >> >> Scientists think they have resolved one of the most controversial >> environmental issues of the past decade: the curious case of the >> missing frogs' legs. >> >> Around the world, frogs are found with missing or misshaped limbs, >> a striking deformity that many researchers believe is caused by >> chemical pollution. >> >> However, tests on frogs and toads have revealed a more natural, >> benign cause. The deformed frogs are actually victims of the >> predatory habits of dragonfly nymphs, which eat the legs of tadpoles. >> >> http://snipr.com/kx70t >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> Michael Blust >> Dept. of Natural Science >> Green Mountain College >> Poultney, VT 05764 >> 802-287-8331 >> blustm AT greenmtn.edu >> >> > > -- > Dr Richard Rowe > Zoology & Tropical Ecology > School of Marine & Tropical Biology > James Cook University > Townsville 4811 > AUSTRALIA > > ph +61 7 47 81 4851 > fax +61 7 47 25 1570 > JCU has CRICOS Provider Code 00117J_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer - Occam From: Richard Rowe <richard.rowe AT jcu.edu.au> Date: Sat, 27 Jun 2009 11:38:22 +1000 _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Frog legs and odonates - simplistic answer From: "Lawson, Tamara" <TamaraLawson AT bhsu.edu> Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 13:55:14 -0600 This article is misleading as it makes the "answer" sound simplistic at best. My husband is a herpetologist (although he prefers to study snakes) and I've occasionally gone to meetings with him and sat in on some of the presentations. The overwhelming thought of most herpetologists that I've talked to (and Nova had a program on amphibians recently as well that stated this idea) is that THERE IS NO SINGLE CAUSE for the mutations (as well as the deaths) observed in amphibians. Research as shown that some chemicals (this includes man-made ones as well as some secreted by plants' roots), some parasites (some worms, some fungi, as well as single-celled species, etc.), and some environmental factors (temperature extremes, salinity, predators, etc.) all contribute to current problem of amphibian deformities. The cause for the world-wide problem is just different in different bodies of water with some research showing multiple cumulative causes and even additive causes in the same pond. It all goes back to the old saying (or it should be a saying) "don't look for simple answers in a complicated system". Tamara Lawson, Science Lab. Manager ________________________________ From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Michael Blust Sent: Friday, June 26, 2009 9:10 AM To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Subject: [Odonata-l] Frog legs and odonates - attempt #2 Legless Frogs Mystery Solved from BBC News Online Scientists think they have resolved one of the most controversial environmental issues of the past decade: the curious case of the missing frogs' legs. Around the world, frogs are found with missing or misshaped limbs, a striking deformity that many researchers believe is caused by chemical pollution. However, tests on frogs and toads have revealed a more natural, benign cause. The deformed frogs are actually victims of the predatory habits of dragonfly nymphs, which eat the legs of tadpoles. http://snipr.com/kx70t ------------------------------------------------------------ Michael Blust Dept. of Natural Science Green Mountain College Poultney, VT 05764 802-287-8331 blustm AT greenmtn.edu _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: BBC - Earth News - Legless frogs mystery solved From: Kathy &/or Dave Biggs <bigsnest AT sonic.net> Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 10:38:29 -0700 http://news.bbc.co.uk/earth/hi/earth_news/newsid_8116000/8116692.stm Yes, this does involve Odonata! Quite interesting to say the least!! Kathy Biggs _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: BBC - Earth News - Legless frogs mystery solved From: Kathy &/or Dave Biggs <bigsnest AT sonic.net> Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 10:38:29 -0700 http://news.bbc.co.uk/earth/hi/earth_news/newsid_8116000/8116692.stm Yes, this does involve Odonata! Quite interesting to say the least!! Kathy Biggs Subject: Frog legs and odonates - attempt #2 From: Michael Blust <BlustM AT greenmtn.edu> Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 11:09:48 -0400 Legless Frogs Mystery Solved from BBC News Online Scientists think they have resolved one of the most controversial environmental issues of the past decade: the curious case of the missing frogs' legs. Around the world, frogs are found with missing or misshaped limbs, a striking deformity that many researchers believe is caused by chemical pollution. However, tests on frogs and toads have revealed a more natural, benign cause. The deformed frogs are actually victims of the predatory habits of dragonfly nymphs, which eat the legs of tadpoles. http://snipr.com/kx70t ------------------------------------------------------------ Michael Blust Dept. of Natural Science Green Mountain College Poultney, VT 05764 802-287-8331 blustm AT greenmtn.edu _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Frog legs and odonates From: Michael Blust <BlustM AT greenmtn.edu> Date: Fri, 26 Jun 2009 11:02:42 -0400 ********************************************************************** The following suspicious attachments were removed from this email: Legless Frogs Mystery Solved.url For more information see http://www.ups.edu/x32870.xml ********************************************************************** Here is one I did not expect.... (Hope the link works.) Mike ------------------------------------------------------------ Michael Blust Dept. of Natural Science Green Mountain College Poultney, VT 05764 802-287-8331 blustm AT greenmtn.edu _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: address change From: "David Tobis" <david.tobis AT nycwf.org> Date: Thu, 25 Jun 2009 09:33:21 -0400 Please use my new email: David.Tobis AT fundforsocialchange.org ---------------------------------------- From: Alex Ardila Sent: Wednesday, June 24, 2009 3:47 PM To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Subject: [Odonata-l] Odonata Front Cover Journal of Zoology (current issue) Hi everyone, The current issue (July) of the Journal of Zoology features a damselfly to illustrate our work on genome size evolution in odonates. I received excellent advise from members of this list during my collection of these critters and learned many things from your discussions. Thank you everyone, Journal of Zoology (current issue): http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/118535410/home Picture provided by Jay Cossey: http://www.images.on.ca/Cossey/Main.htm Cheers, Alex _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Odonata Front Cover Journal of Zoology (current issue) From: Alex Ardila <aardila AT uoguelph.ca> Date: Wed, 24 Jun 2009 15:45:12 -0400 (EDT) Hi everyone, The current issue (July) of the Journal of Zoology features a damselfly to illustrate our work on genome size evolution in odonates. I received excellent advise from members of this list during my collection of these critters and learned many things from your discussions. Thank you everyone, Journal of Zoology (current issue): http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/118535410/home Picture provided by Jay Cossey: http://www.images.on.ca/Cossey/Main.htm Cheers, Alex _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Dragonflies on TV From: "McCormac, Jim" <Jim.McCormac AT dnr.state.oh.us> Date: Mon, 8 Jun 2009 09:55:41 -0400 Hi all, I thought that the readers of this list might enjoy viewing a brief story done by the Ohio Division of Wildlife's Wild Ohio TV show. It covers the first (but hopefully not the last!) Ohio Dragonfly Symposium that was held in Wooster Ohio in July 2007. There are interviews and footage with our keynote speaker, Dennis Paulson, as well as Ohio experts Bob Glotzhober and Larry Rosche. We attracted 140 -150 participants, and it was a truly great time. We had no idea that so many folks would be interested enough to attend, and we had lots of great feedback. We'll do it again, hopefully next year and I bet it'll be bigger that the first. For the video, go here: http://www.dnr.state.oh.us/Default.aspx?tabid=21805 Jim Jim McCormac Ohio Division of Wildlife 2045 Morse Rd., G-2 Columbus, Ohio 43229 614-265-6440 614-262-1143 fax -----Original Message----- From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Dubois, Robert - DNR Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2009 2:27 PM To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Could it be a Variable Darner??? (No response up to now...) Hi Michel, Part of the lack of response may be that male Aeshnas are easy to identify if you can see the right parts (side stripes, face, terminal apps), but none of these are clear in any of the photographs. I agree with Jim that it is not interrupta or constricta. Based on the smidgen of side stripe partially visible in one of the photos it might be canadensis. Have a great spring! Bob Bob DuBois Research Scientist Ecological Inventory and Monitoring Department of Natural Resources 1401 Tower Avenue Superior, WI 54880 ph: (715)392-6976 fax: (715)392-7993 Robert.Dubois AT Wisconsin.gov ________________________________ From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Jim Johnson Sent: Saturday, June 06, 2009 9:35 PM To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Could it be a Variable Darner??? (No response up to now...) Michel, From what I can see of the thoracic markings in the second image it is not A. interrupta, and the appendages are wrong for A. constrcta. That leaves A. canadensis, although you may have to consider A. verticalis as well (not sure if the species is in that area or not). Jim Johnson Vancouver, Washington jt_johnson AT comcast.net http://odonata.bogfoot.net/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michel Pilon" To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Sent: Saturday, June 6, 2009 4:56:39 PM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific Subject: [Odonata-l] Could it be a Variable Darner??? (No response up to now...) Hello all, Hum... It looks harder than I thought for I received no answer (0) from anybody concerning that ID...! I'm hesitating between 3 Darners: - Aeshna canadensis; - Aeshna interrupta; - Aeshna constricta; As I said, that specimen was photographied in New Hampshire September 12th, 2008. Maybe the date can help??? Which one can I remove from the above list? Any suggestion about its ID will be very appreciated :-) Thank you very much ! Michel Pilon Naturalist-photographer Quebec, Canada Mes Parcours Nature http://parcours.pilonm.org ________________________________ De: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu de la part de Pilon, Michel Date: jeu. 2009-06-04 21:21 À: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Objet : [Odonata-l] Could it be a Variable Darner??? Hello all, Here are 3 pictures of a Dragonfly photographied at the "Old Main in the Mountain" (White Mountain, New Hampshire), September 12th, 2008. Could it be a Variable Darner (Aeshna interrupta)?? http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu74.jpg http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu75.jpg http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu76.jpg This dragonfly is so colorful and Nature does so lovely living!!! Thank you very much for you always so appreciated help :-) Michel Pilon Naturalist-photographer Quebec, Canada Mes Parcours Nature http://parcours.pilonm.org _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Could it be a Variable Darner??? (No response up to now...) From: "Dubois, Robert - DNR" <Robert.Dubois AT wisconsin.gov> Date: Sun, 7 Jun 2009 13:26:51 -0500 Hi Michel, Part of the lack of response may be that male Aeshnas are easy to identify if you can see the right parts (side stripes, face, terminal apps), but none of these are clear in any of the photographs. I agree with Jim that it is not interrupta or constricta. Based on the smidgen of side stripe partially visible in one of the photos it might be canadensis. Have a great spring! Bob Bob DuBois Research Scientist Ecological Inventory and Monitoring Department of Natural Resources 1401 Tower Avenue Superior, WI 54880 ph: (715)392-6976 fax: (715)392-7993 Robert.Dubois AT Wisconsin.gov ________________________________ From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Jim Johnson Sent: Saturday, June 06, 2009 9:35 PM To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Could it be a Variable Darner??? (No response up to now...) Michel, >From what I can see of the thoracic markings in the second image it is not A. interrupta, and the appendages are wrong for A. constrcta. That leaves A. canadensis, although you may have to consider A. verticalis as well (not sure if the species is in that area or not). Jim Johnson Vancouver, Washington jt_johnson AT comcast.net http://odonata.bogfoot.net/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michel Pilon" To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Sent: Saturday, June 6, 2009 4:56:39 PM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific Subject: [Odonata-l] Could it be a Variable Darner??? (No response up to now...) Hello all, Hum... It looks harder than I thought for I received no answer (0) from anybody concerning that ID...! I'm hesitating between 3 Darners: - Aeshna canadensis; - Aeshna interrupta; - Aeshna constricta; As I said, that specimen was photographied in New Hampshire September 12th, 2008. Maybe the date can help??? Which one can I remove from the above list? Any suggestion about its ID will be very appreciated :-) Thank you very much ! Michel Pilon Naturalist-photographer Quebec, Canada Mes Parcours Nature http://parcours.pilonm.org ________________________________ De: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu de la part de Pilon, Michel Date: jeu. 2009-06-04 21:21 À: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Objet : [Odonata-l] Could it be a Variable Darner??? Hello all, Here are 3 pictures of a Dragonfly photographied at the "Old Main in the Mountain" (White Mountain, New Hampshire), September 12th, 2008. Could it be a Variable Darner (Aeshna interrupta)?? http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu74.jpg http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu75.jpg http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu76.jpg This dragonfly is so colorful and Nature does so lovely living!!! Thank you very much for you always so appreciated help :-) Michel Pilon Naturalist-photographer Quebec, Canada Mes Parcours Nature http://parcours.pilonm.org _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Could it be a Variable Darner??? (No response up to now...) From: Jim Johnson <jt_johnson AT comcast.net> Date: Sun, 7 Jun 2009 02:34:41 +0000 (UTC) Michel, >From what I can see of the thoracic markings in the second image it is not A. interrupta, and the appendages are wrong for A. constrcta. That leaves A. canadensis, although you may have to consider A. verticalis as well (not sure if the species is in that area or not). Jim Johnson Vancouver, Washington jt_johnson AT comcast.net http://odonata.bogfoot.net/ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michel Pilon" To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Sent: Saturday, June 6, 2009 4:56:39 PM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific Subject: [Odonata-l] Could it be a Variable Darner??? (No response up to now...) Hello all,   Hum... It looks harder than I thought for I received no answer (0) from anybody concerning that ID...!     I'm hesitating between 3 Darners:   - Aeshna canadensis; - Aeshna interrupta; - Aeshna constricta;   As I said, that specimen was photographied in New Hampshire September 12th, 2008.   Maybe the date can help??? Which one can I remove from the above list?   Any suggestion about its ID will be very appreciated :-)       Thank you very much !   Michel Pilon Naturalist-photographer Quebec, Canada Mes Parcours Nature http://parcours.pilonm.org ________________________________ De: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu de la part de Pilon, Michel Date: jeu. 2009-06-04 21:21 À: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Objet : [Odonata-l] Could it be a Variable Darner??? Hello all, Here are 3 pictures of a Dragonfly photographied at the "Old Main in the Mountain" (White Mountain, New Hampshire), September 12th, 2008. Could it be a Variable Darner (Aeshna interrupta)?? http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu74.jpg http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu75.jpg http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu76.jpg This dragonfly is so colorful and Nature does so lovely living!!! Thank you very much for you always so appreciated help :-) Michel Pilon Naturalist-photographer Quebec, Canada Mes Parcours Nature http://parcours.pilonm.org   _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Could it be a Variable Darner??? (No response up to now...) From: "Pilon, Michel" <Michel.Pilon AT rncan-nrcan.gc.ca> Date: Sat, 6 Jun 2009 19:56:39 -0400 Hello all, Hum... It looks harder than I thought for I received no answer (0) from anybody concerning that ID...! I'm hesitating between 3 Darners: - Aeshna canadensis; - Aeshna interrupta; - Aeshna constricta; As I said, that specimen was photographied in New Hampshire September 12th, 2008. Maybe the date can help??? Which one can I remove from the above list? Any suggestion about its ID will be very appreciated :-) Thank you very much ! Michel Pilon Naturalist-photographer Quebec, Canada Mes Parcours Nature http://parcours.pilonm.org ________________________________ De: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu de la part de Pilon, Michel Date: jeu. 2009-06-04 21:21 À: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Objet : [Odonata-l] Could it be a Variable Darner??? Hello all, Here are 3 pictures of a Dragonfly photographied at the "Old Main in the Mountain" (White Mountain, New Hampshire), September 12th, 2008. Could it be a Variable Darner (Aeshna interrupta)?? http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu74.jpg http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu75.jpg http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu76.jpg This dragonfly is so colorful and Nature does so lovely living!!! Thank you very much for you always so appreciated help :-) Michel Pilon Naturalist-photographer Quebec, Canada Mes Parcours Nature http://parcours.pilonm.org _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Could it be a Variable Darner??? From: "Pilon, Michel" <Michel.Pilon AT rncan-nrcan.gc.ca> Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2009 21:21:00 -0400 Hello all, Here are 3 pictures of a Dragonfly photographied at the "Old Main in the Mountain" (White Mountain, New Hampshire), September 12th, 2008. Could it be a Variable Darner (Aeshna interrupta)?? http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu74.jpg http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu75.jpg http://parcours.pilonm.org/pictures/inconnu76.jpg This dragonfly is so colorful and Nature does so lovely living!!! Thank you very much for you always so appreciated help :-) Michel Pilon Naturalist-photographer Quebec, Canada Mes Parcours Nature http://parcours.pilonm.org _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Request for ARGIA Contributions From: Todd Sformo <tlsformo AT alaska.edu> Date: Thu, 4 Jun 2009 13:17:26 -0800 Just thought I would let "you" know that I saw the first dragonfly of the season day flying in Fairbanks, Alaska. I checked on Sunday at a pond, no activity. Today's creature was Libellula quadrimaculata. -Todd On Tue, May 19, 2009 at 1:52 PM, John Abbott wrote: > > It is time for another issue of ARGIA and I would like to solicit any > articles, notes, or other information that you think the readers might > enjoy.  You can send content to me anytime, but I would like your > submissions by no later than May 27th to be considered for this issue.  If > you are not familiar with ARGIA, it is the News Journal for the Dragonfly > Society of the Americas.  Information about both the journal and the society > can be found on OdonataCentral at > http://www.odonatacentral.org/index.php/PageAction.get/name/DSAHomePage and > I have pasted the Instructions to Authors below. > > Thanks in advance for your contributions, > John > --------------------------------------------------------- > John C. Abbott, Ph.D. > Curator of Entomology, Texas Natural History Collections > Section of Integrative Biology > 1 University Station #L7000 > The University of Texas at Austin > Austin, Texas 78712  USA > > Office Phone: (512) 471-5467 > Lab Phone: (512) 232-1896 > Fax: (512) 475-6286 > http://www.sbs.utexas.edu/jcabbott > http://www.odonatacentral.com > Email: jcabbott AT mail.utexas.edu > > > > Instructions to Authors for ARGIA Submissions > > > > Digital submissions of all materials (via e-mail or CD) are vastly preferred > to hardcopy. If digital submissions are not possible, contact the Editor > before sending anything. All material must be sent directly to the Editor, > John C. Abbott . > > > > All articles and notes are preferably submitted in Word or Rich Text Format, > without any figures or tables, or their captions, embedded. Only minimal > formatting to facilitate review is needed—single column with paragraph > returns and bold/italic type where necessary. Include captions for all > figures and tables in a separate document. > > > > Include a title, author name(s), and contact information (especially email) > with a line between each.  The article or note should follow this > information.  Paragraphs should be separated by a line and the first line > should not be indented.  Where possible always refer to the scientific name > of a species followed by its official common name in parentheses. > > > > Submit figures individually as separate files, named so that each can be > easily identified and matched with its caption. Requirements vary depending > on the type of graphic. > > > > Photographs and other complex (continuous tone) raster graphics should be > submitted as TIFF (preferred) or JPEG files with a minimum of 300 ppi at the > intended print size. If unsure about the final print size, keep in mind that > over-sized graphics can be scaled down without loss of quality, but they > cannot be scaled up without loss of quality. The printable area of a page of > Argia or BAO is 6.5 × 9.0 inches, so no graphics will exceed these > dimensions. Do not add any graphic features such as text, arrows, circles, > etc. to photographs. If these are necessary, include a note to the Editor > with the figure’s caption, describing what is needed. The editorial staff > will crop, scale, sample, and enhance photographs as deemed necessary and > will add graphics requested by the author. > > > > Charts, graphs, diagrams, and other vector graphics (e.g. computer-drawn > maps) are best submitted in Illustrator format or EPS. If this is not > possible, then submit as raster graphics (PNG or TIFF) with a minimum of 600 > ppi at the intended print size. You may be asked to provide the raw data for > charts and graphs if submitted graphics are deemed to be unsatisfactory. > When charts and graphs are generated in Excel, please submit the Excel > document with each chart or graph on a separate sheet and each sheet named > appropriately (e.g. “Fig. 1”, “Fig. 2”, etc.) > > > > Tables may be submitted as Word documents or Excel spreadsheets. If Excel is > used, place each table on a separate sheet and name each sheet appropriately > (e.g. “Table 1”, “Table 2”, etc.) > > > _______________________________________________ > Odonata-l mailing list > Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu > https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l > > -- Todd Sformo 907.474.6067 Brian Barnes Lab University of Alaska Fairbanks Institute of Arctic Biology _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Animal Planet show about dragonflies From: "wjsigman" <wjsigman AT gmail.com> Date: Mon, 25 May 2009 08:03:35 -0700 Hello Laura(hopefully), I have been searching for clips of dragonflys ect.. in flight. I realize that this particular topic was in front of you back in 2006, and that was a long time ago. I would like to ask if I could get any clips you might have or link to them. Thank You for your time and condiseration. WJS wjsigman AT gmail.com_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Sound of dragonfly in flight? From: "wjsigman" <wjsigman AT gmail.com> Date: Mon, 25 May 2009 07:19:18 -0700 Hello, I too am looking for the sound of a dragonfly in flight. I was looking for a sound I heard many years ago which was like the droning of a dragonfly. I see the last time anyone looked for this was in 2005, I do not know if I can be helped or not but thank you for your time and consideration. WJS wjsigman AT gmail.com_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Request for ARGIA Contributions From: John Abbott <jcabbott AT mail.utexas.edu> Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 16:52:28 -0500 It is time for another issue of ARGIA and I would like to solicit any articles, notes, or other information that you think the readers might enjoy. You can send content to me anytime, but I would like your submissions by no later than May 27th to be considered for this issue. If you are not familiar with ARGIA, it is the News Journal for the Dragonfly Society of the Americas. Information about both the journal and the society can be found on OdonataCentral at http://www.odonatacentral.org/index.php/PageAction.get/name/DSAHomePage and I have pasted the Instructions to Authors below. Thanks in advance for your contributions, John --------------------------------------------------------- John C. Abbott, Ph.D. Curator of Entomology, Texas Natural History Collections Section of Integrative Biology 1 University Station #L7000 The University of Texas at Austin Austin, Texas 78712 USA Office Phone: (512) 471-5467 Lab Phone: (512) 232-1896 Fax: (512) 475-6286 http://www.sbs.utexas.edu/jcabbott http://www.odonatacentral.com Email: jcabbott AT mail.utexas.edu *Instructions to Authors for ARGIA Submissions* Digital submissions of all materials (via e-mail or CD) are vastly preferred to hardcopy. If digital submissions are not possible, contact the Editor before sending anything. All material must be sent directly to the Editor, John C. Abbott . All articles and notes are preferably submitted in Word or Rich Text Format, without any figures or tables, or their captions, embedded. Only minimal formatting to facilitate review is needed?single column with paragraph returns and bold/italic type where necessary. Include captions for all figures and tables in a separate document. Include a title, author name(s), and contact information (especially email) with a line between each. The article or note should follow this information. Paragraphs should be separated by a line and the first line should not be indented. Where possible always refer to the scientific name of a species followed by its official common name in parentheses. Submit figures individually as separate files, named so that each can be easily identified and matched with its caption. Requirements vary depending on the type of graphic. Photographs and other complex (continuous tone) raster graphics should be submitted as TIFF (preferred) or JPEG files with a minimum of 300 ppi at the intended print size. If unsure about the final print size, keep in mind that over-sized graphics can be scaled down without loss of quality, but they cannot be scaled up without loss of quality. The printable area of a page of Argia or BAO is 6.5 × 9.0 inches, so no graphics will exceed these dimensions. Do not add any graphic features such as text, arrows, circles, etc. to photographs. If these are necessary, include a note to the Editor with the figure?s caption, describing what is needed. The editorial staff will crop, scale, sample, and enhance photographs as deemed necessary and will add graphics requested by the author. Charts, graphs, diagrams, and other vector graphics (e.g. computer-drawn maps) are best submitted in Illustrator format or EPS. If this is not possible, then submit as raster graphics (PNG or TIFF) with a minimum of 600 ppi at the intended print size. You may be asked to provide the raw data for charts and graphs if submitted graphics are deemed to be unsatisfactory. When charts and graphs are generated in Excel, please submit the Excel document with each chart or graph on a separate sheet and each sheet named appropriately (e.g. ?Fig. 1?, ?Fig. 2?, etc.) Tables may be submitted as Word documents or Excel spreadsheets. If Excel is used, place each table on a separate sheet and name each sheet appropriately (e.g. ?Table 1?, ?Table 2?, etc.) _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Request for ARGIA Contributions From: John Abbott <jcabbott AT mail.utexas.edu> Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 16:52:28 -0500 It is time for another issue of ARGIA and I would like to solicit any articles, notes, or other information that you think the readers might enjoy. You can send content to me anytime, but I would like your submissions by no later than May 27th to be considered for this issue. If you are not familiar with ARGIA, it is the News Journal for the Dragonfly Society of the Americas. Information about both the journal and the society can be found on OdonataCentral at http://www.odonatacentral.org/index.php/PageAction.get/name/DSAHomePage and I have pasted the Instructions to Authors below. Thanks in advance for your contributions, John --------------------------------------------------------- John C. Abbott, Ph.D. Curator of Entomology, Texas Natural History Collections Section of Integrative Biology 1 University Station #L7000 The University of Texas at Austin Austin, Texas 78712 USA Office Phone: (512) 471-5467 Lab Phone: (512) 232-1896 Fax: (512) 475-6286 http://www.sbs.utexas.edu/jcabbott http://www.odonatacentral.com Email: jcabbott AT mail.utexas.edu *Instructions to Authors for ARGIA Submissions* Digital submissions of all materials (via e-mail or CD) are vastly preferred to hardcopy. If digital submissions are not possible, contact the Editor before sending anything. All material must be sent directly to the Editor, John C. Abbott . All articles and notes are preferably submitted in Word or Rich Text Format, without any figures or tables, or their captions, embedded. Only minimal formatting to facilitate review is needed?single column with paragraph returns and bold/italic type where necessary. Include captions for all figures and tables in a separate document. Include a title, author name(s), and contact information (especially email) with a line between each. The article or note should follow this information. Paragraphs should be separated by a line and the first line should not be indented. Where possible always refer to the scientific name of a species followed by its official common name in parentheses. Submit figures individually as separate files, named so that each can be easily identified and matched with its caption. Requirements vary depending on the type of graphic. Photographs and other complex (continuous tone) raster graphics should be submitted as TIFF (preferred) or JPEG files with a minimum of 300 ppi at the intended print size. If unsure about the final print size, keep in mind that over-sized graphics can be scaled down without loss of quality, but they cannot be scaled up without loss of quality. The printable area of a page of Argia or BAO is 6.5 × 9.0 inches, so no graphics will exceed these dimensions. Do not add any graphic features such as text, arrows, circles, etc. to photographs. If these are necessary, include a note to the Editor with the figure?s caption, describing what is needed. The editorial staff will crop, scale, sample, and enhance photographs as deemed necessary and will add graphics requested by the author. Charts, graphs, diagrams, and other vector graphics (e.g. computer-drawn maps) are best submitted in Illustrator format or EPS. If this is not possible, then submit as raster graphics (PNG or TIFF) with a minimum of 600 ppi at the intended print size. You may be asked to provide the raw data for charts and graphs if submitted graphics are deemed to be unsatisfactory. When charts and graphs are generated in Excel, please submit the Excel document with each chart or graph on a separate sheet and each sheet named appropriately (e.g. ?Fig. 1?, ?Fig. 2?, etc.) Tables may be submitted as Word documents or Excel spreadsheets. If Excel is used, place each table on a separate sheet and name each sheet appropriately (e.g. ?Table 1?, ?Table 2?, etc.) Subject: Re: Request for ARGIA Contributions From: John Abbott <jcabbott AT mail.utexas.edu> Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 16:52:28 -0500 It is time for another issue of ARGIA and I would like to solicit any articles, notes, or other information that you think the readers might enjoy. You can send content to me anytime, but I would like your submissions by no later than May 27th to be considered for this issue. If you are not familiar with ARGIA, it is the News Journal for the Dragonfly Society of the Americas. Information about both the journal and the society can be found on OdonataCentral at http://www.odonatacentral.org/index.php/PageAction.get/name/DSAHomePage and I have pasted the Instructions to Authors below. Thanks in advance for your contributions, John --------------------------------------------------------- John C. Abbott, Ph.D. Curator of Entomology, Texas Natural History Collections Section of Integrative Biology 1 University Station #L7000 The University of Texas at Austin Austin, Texas 78712 USA Office Phone: (512) 471-5467 Lab Phone: (512) 232-1896 Fax: (512) 475-6286 http://www.sbs.utexas.edu/jcabbott http://www.odonatacentral.com Email: jcabbott AT mail.utexas.edu *Instructions to Authors for ARGIA Submissions* Digital submissions of all materials (via e-mail or CD) are vastly preferred to hardcopy. If digital submissions are not possible, contact the Editor before sending anything. All material must be sent directly to the Editor, John C. Abbott . All articles and notes are preferably submitted in Word or Rich Text Format, without any figures or tables, or their captions, embedded. Only minimal formatting to facilitate review is needed?single column with paragraph returns and bold/italic type where necessary. Include captions for all figures and tables in a separate document. Include a title, author name(s), and contact information (especially email) with a line between each. The article or note should follow this information. Paragraphs should be separated by a line and the first line should not be indented. Where possible always refer to the scientific name of a species followed by its official common name in parentheses. Submit figures individually as separate files, named so that each can be easily identified and matched with its caption. Requirements vary depending on the type of graphic. Photographs and other complex (continuous tone) raster graphics should be submitted as TIFF (preferred) or JPEG files with a minimum of 300 ppi at the intended print size. If unsure about the final print size, keep in mind that over-sized graphics can be scaled down without loss of quality, but they cannot be scaled up without loss of quality. The printable area of a page of Argia or BAO is 6.5 × 9.0 inches, so no graphics will exceed these dimensions. Do not add any graphic features such as text, arrows, circles, etc. to photographs. If these are necessary, include a note to the Editor with the figure?s caption, describing what is needed. The editorial staff will crop, scale, sample, and enhance photographs as deemed necessary and will add graphics requested by the author. Charts, graphs, diagrams, and other vector graphics (e.g. computer-drawn maps) are best submitted in Illustrator format or EPS. If this is not possible, then submit as raster graphics (PNG or TIFF) with a minimum of 600 ppi at the intended print size. You may be asked to provide the raw data for charts and graphs if submitted graphics are deemed to be unsatisfactory. When charts and graphs are generated in Excel, please submit the Excel document with each chart or graph on a separate sheet and each sheet named appropriately (e.g. ?Fig. 1?, ?Fig. 2?, etc.) Tables may be submitted as Word documents or Excel spreadsheets. If Excel is used, place each table on a separate sheet and name each sheet appropriately (e.g. ?Table 1?, ?Table 2?, etc.) Subject: Re: Request for ARGIA Contributions From: John Abbott <jcabbott AT mail.utexas.edu> Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 16:52:28 -0500 It is time for another issue of ARGIA and I would like to solicit any articles, notes, or other information that you think the readers might enjoy. You can send content to me anytime, but I would like your submissions by no later than May 27th to be considered for this issue. If you are not familiar with ARGIA, it is the News Journal for the Dragonfly Society of the Americas. Information about both the journal and the society can be found on OdonataCentral at http://www.odonatacentral.org/index.php/PageAction.get/name/DSAHomePage and I have pasted the Instructions to Authors below. Thanks in advance for your contributions, John --------------------------------------------------------- John C. Abbott, Ph.D. Curator of Entomology, Texas Natural History Collections Section of Integrative Biology 1 University Station #L7000 The University of Texas at Austin Austin, Texas 78712 USA Office Phone: (512) 471-5467 Lab Phone: (512) 232-1896 Fax: (512) 475-6286 http://www.sbs.utexas.edu/jcabbott http://www.odonatacentral.com Email: jcabbott AT mail.utexas.edu *Instructions to Authors for ARGIA Submissions* Digital submissions of all materials (via e-mail or CD) are vastly preferred to hardcopy. If digital submissions are not possible, contact the Editor before sending anything. All material must be sent directly to the Editor, John C. Abbott . All articles and notes are preferably submitted in Word or Rich Text Format, without any figures or tables, or their captions, embedded. Only minimal formatting to facilitate review is needed?single column with paragraph returns and bold/italic type where necessary. Include captions for all figures and tables in a separate document. Include a title, author name(s), and contact information (especially email) with a line between each. The article or note should follow this information. Paragraphs should be separated by a line and the first line should not be indented. Where possible always refer to the scientific name of a species followed by its official common name in parentheses. Submit figures individually as separate files, named so that each can be easily identified and matched with its caption. Requirements vary depending on the type of graphic. Photographs and other complex (continuous tone) raster graphics should be submitted as TIFF (preferred) or JPEG files with a minimum of 300 ppi at the intended print size. If unsure about the final print size, keep in mind that over-sized graphics can be scaled down without loss of quality, but they cannot be scaled up without loss of quality. The printable area of a page of Argia or BAO is 6.5 × 9.0 inches, so no graphics will exceed these dimensions. Do not add any graphic features such as text, arrows, circles, etc. to photographs. If these are necessary, include a note to the Editor with the figure?s caption, describing what is needed. The editorial staff will crop, scale, sample, and enhance photographs as deemed necessary and will add graphics requested by the author. Charts, graphs, diagrams, and other vector graphics (e.g. computer-drawn maps) are best submitted in Illustrator format or EPS. If this is not possible, then submit as raster graphics (PNG or TIFF) with a minimum of 600 ppi at the intended print size. You may be asked to provide the raw data for charts and graphs if submitted graphics are deemed to be unsatisfactory. When charts and graphs are generated in Excel, please submit the Excel document with each chart or graph on a separate sheet and each sheet named appropriately (e.g. ?Fig. 1?, ?Fig. 2?, etc.) Tables may be submitted as Word documents or Excel spreadsheets. If Excel is used, place each table on a separate sheet and name each sheet appropriately (e.g. ?Table 1?, ?Table 2?, etc.) Subject: Re: Request for ARGIA Contributions From: John Abbott <jcabbott AT mail.utexas.edu> Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 16:52:28 -0500 It is time for another issue of ARGIA and I would like to solicit any articles, notes, or other information that you think the readers might enjoy. You can send content to me anytime, but I would like your submissions by no later than May 27th to be considered for this issue. If you are not familiar with ARGIA, it is the News Journal for the Dragonfly Society of the Americas. Information about both the journal and the society can be found on OdonataCentral at http://www.odonatacentral.org/index.php/PageAction.get/name/DSAHomePage and I have pasted the Instructions to Authors below. Thanks in advance for your contributions, John --------------------------------------------------------- John C. Abbott, Ph.D. Curator of Entomology, Texas Natural History Collections Section of Integrative Biology 1 University Station #L7000 The University of Texas at Austin Austin, Texas 78712 USA Office Phone: (512) 471-5467 Lab Phone: (512) 232-1896 Fax: (512) 475-6286 http://www.sbs.utexas.edu/jcabbott http://www.odonatacentral.com Email: jcabbott AT mail.utexas.edu *Instructions to Authors for ARGIA Submissions* Digital submissions of all materials (via e-mail or CD) are vastly preferred to hardcopy. If digital submissions are not possible, contact the Editor before sending anything. All material must be sent directly to the Editor, John C. Abbott . All articles and notes are preferably submitted in Word or Rich Text Format, without any figures or tables, or their captions, embedded. Only minimal formatting to facilitate review is needed?single column with paragraph returns and bold/italic type where necessary. Include captions for all figures and tables in a separate document. Include a title, author name(s), and contact information (especially email) with a line between each. The article or note should follow this information. Paragraphs should be separated by a line and the first line should not be indented. Where possible always refer to the scientific name of a species followed by its official common name in parentheses. Submit figures individually as separate files, named so that each can be easily identified and matched with its caption. Requirements vary depending on the type of graphic. Photographs and other complex (continuous tone) raster graphics should be submitted as TIFF (preferred) or JPEG files with a minimum of 300 ppi at the intended print size. If unsure about the final print size, keep in mind that over-sized graphics can be scaled down without loss of quality, but they cannot be scaled up without loss of quality. The printable area of a page of Argia or BAO is 6.5 × 9.0 inches, so no graphics will exceed these dimensions. Do not add any graphic features such as text, arrows, circles, etc. to photographs. If these are necessary, include a note to the Editor with the figure?s caption, describing what is needed. The editorial staff will crop, scale, sample, and enhance photographs as deemed necessary and will add graphics requested by the author. Charts, graphs, diagrams, and other vector graphics (e.g. computer-drawn maps) are best submitted in Illustrator format or EPS. If this is not possible, then submit as raster graphics (PNG or TIFF) with a minimum of 600 ppi at the intended print size. You may be asked to provide the raw data for charts and graphs if submitted graphics are deemed to be unsatisfactory. When charts and graphs are generated in Excel, please submit the Excel document with each chart or graph on a separate sheet and each sheet named appropriately (e.g. ?Fig. 1?, ?Fig. 2?, etc.) Tables may be submitted as Word documents or Excel spreadsheets. If Excel is used, place each table on a separate sheet and name each sheet appropriately (e.g. ?Table 1?, ?Table 2?, etc.) Subject: Re: Request for ARGIA Contributions From: John Abbott <jcabbott AT mail.utexas.edu> Date: Tue, 19 May 2009 16:52:28 -0500 It is time for another issue of ARGIA and I would like to solicit any articles, notes, or other information that you think the readers might enjoy. You can send content to me anytime, but I would like your submissions by no later than May 27th to be considered for this issue. If you are not familiar with ARGIA, it is the News Journal for the Dragonfly Society of the Americas. Information about both the journal and the society can be found on OdonataCentral at http://www.odonatacentral.org/index.php/PageAction.get/name/DSAHomePage and I have pasted the Instructions to Authors below. Thanks in advance for your contributions, John --------------------------------------------------------- John C. Abbott, Ph.D. Curator of Entomology, Texas Natural History Collections Section of Integrative Biology 1 University Station #L7000 The University of Texas at Austin Austin, Texas 78712 USA Office Phone: (512) 471-5467 Lab Phone: (512) 232-1896 Fax: (512) 475-6286 http://www.sbs.utexas.edu/jcabbott http://www.odonatacentral.com Email: jcabbott AT mail.utexas.edu *Instructions to Authors for ARGIA Submissions* Digital submissions of all materials (via e-mail or CD) are vastly preferred to hardcopy. If digital submissions are not possible, contact the Editor before sending anything. All material must be sent directly to the Editor, John C. Abbott . All articles and notes are preferably submitted in Word or Rich Text Format, without any figures or tables, or their captions, embedded. Only minimal formatting to facilitate review is needed?single column with paragraph returns and bold/italic type where necessary. Include captions for all figures and tables in a separate document. Include a title, author name(s), and contact information (especially email) with a line between each. The article or note should follow this information. Paragraphs should be separated by a line and the first line should not be indented. Where possible always refer to the scientific name of a species followed by its official common name in parentheses. Submit figures individually as separate files, named so that each can be easily identified and matched with its caption. Requirements vary depending on the type of graphic. Photographs and other complex (continuous tone) raster graphics should be submitted as TIFF (preferred) or JPEG files with a minimum of 300 ppi at the intended print size. If unsure about the final print size, keep in mind that over-sized graphics can be scaled down without loss of quality, but they cannot be scaled up without loss of quality. The printable area of a page of Argia or BAO is 6.5 × 9.0 inches, so no graphics will exceed these dimensions. Do not add any graphic features such as text, arrows, circles, etc. to photographs. If these are necessary, include a note to the Editor with the figure?s caption, describing what is needed. The editorial staff will crop, scale, sample, and enhance photographs as deemed necessary and will add graphics requested by the author. Charts, graphs, diagrams, and other vector graphics (e.g. computer-drawn maps) are best submitted in Illustrator format or EPS. If this is not possible, then submit as raster graphics (PNG or TIFF) with a minimum of 600 ppi at the intended print size. You may be asked to provide the raw data for charts and graphs if submitted graphics are deemed to be unsatisfactory. When charts and graphs are generated in Excel, please submit the Excel document with each chart or graph on a separate sheet and each sheet named appropriately (e.g. ?Fig. 1?, ?Fig. 2?, etc.) Tables may be submitted as Word documents or Excel spreadsheets. If Excel is used, place each table on a separate sheet and name each sheet appropriately (e.g. ?Table 1?, ?Table 2?, etc.) [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Subject: Dragonfly status From: Chris Hill <Chill AT coastal.edu> Date: Mon, 18 May 2009 07:39:19 -0400 Interesting summary of a study of how many odonates may be endangered worldwide: http://news.bbc.co.uk/earth/hi/earth_news/newsid_8040000/8040926.stm > Link to the journal article is below (not free): http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6V5X-4W73H78-1&_user=10&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=5a25bd3454b040757149b5a8a70cb313 CH ************************************************************************ Christopher E. Hill Biology Department Coastal Carolina University Conway, SC 29528-1954 chill AT coastal.edu http://ww2.coastal.edu/chill/chill.htm I've long thought that too much systematic work somehow blunts the faculties. - Charles Darwin _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: mistake in previous message about Syria From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 16:17:02 -0700 The gentleman who asked for help with Syrian odonates is Faez Mousatat, his email faez_mousatat AT yahoo.com. Sorry for the misspelling, which I copied from his message! ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: help wanted from Syria From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 15:50:23 -0700 I am forwarding this message. Please respond to Faez Moustat, the original sender. Thanks! Begin forwarded message: > From: faez mousatat [mailto:faez_mousatat AT yahoo.com] > Sent: Wednesday, May 13, 2009 6:32 AM > To: Peter H Wimberger > Subject: Web Site Contact Form > > Sender's name: faez mousatat > Sender's e-mail address: faez_mousatat AT yahoo.com > Message: > Hi Dear Dr. peter Wimberger I am studding in Aleppo university in > Syria > Postgraduate ( doctorate) I treating order odonata in North and East > Syria Could you pleas help me and sent some taxonomy key four > odonata ( > adults and larva ) Or sent to me some address of who can help me My > email : faez_moustat AT yahoo.com Thanks for all Regards > > From form at http://www.pugetsound.edu/x6118.xml > ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Montgomery - Diastatops From: Helmut Strasser <helmuts AT furtim.de> Date: Wed, 13 May 2009 09:07:13 +0200 Hello folks, I'm searching for a paper by Basil Elwood *Montgomery* from 1940: A revision of the genus Diastatops and a study of the leg structures of related genera As far as I now the pdf is available at the Iowa State University. Could maybe someone send me a copy of it? Thanks a lot Cheers Helmut_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Joe Engler/MOBILE/R1/FWS/DOI is out of the office. From: Joe_Engler AT fws.gov Date: Sat, 2 May 2009 16:00:27 -0700 I will be out of the office starting 05/01/2009 and will not return until 05/18/2009. I will respond to your message when I return. _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Dennis Paulson's and other recent books From: "Dubois, Robert - DNR" <Robert.Dubois AT wisconsin.gov> Date: Sat, 2 May 2009 15:39:44 -0500 I'm so glad you said this Dennis, and I completely echo your sentiments. Ed's superb book is one of my favorites. My goodness, am I ever glad Mike Reese and I didn't publish our book a few years earlier! Ed's coming Anisoptera guide is sure to become a classic. Ed, your contributions to odonatology are unique and priceless. My only concern is that you've set the bar so high for yourself! Bob DuBois Bob DuBois Research Scientist Ecological Inventory and Monitoring Department of Natural Resources 1401 Tower Avenue Superior, WI 54880 ph: (715)392-6976 fax: (715)392-7993 Robert.Dubois AT Wisconsin.gov ________________________________ From: odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu [mailto:odonata-l-bounces AT listhost.ups.edu] On Behalf Of Dennis Paulson Sent: Saturday, May 02, 2009 3:23 PM To: Odonata-l Cc: azurebluet Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Dennis Paulson's and other recent books Ed Lam, who has so much praise for other books, gave us only hints of his own books. Anyone who has his Damselflies of the Northeast knows what a superb book Ed can put together, with beautiful and accurate paintings and drawings and informative text. Now he is working on a field guide to the Anisoptera of North America north of Mexico, and that is surely to be one of the most significant books to savor for the future. Be sure to visit his website http://homepage.mac.com/edlam/ to travel with him as he gathers material for his book. Don't forget to check out his other works while you are there, for example http://homepage.mac.com/edlam/Illustration/44.html. Dennis Paulson On Apr 22, 2009, at 8:03 PM, azurebluet wrote: Hi Marion and all, I also received my copy of "Dragonflies and Damselflies of the West" yesterday and I wish to congratulate Dennis Paulson for putting together such a feast of a book. I couldn't wait until the kids were in bed so I could finally sit down and have a closer look. It is well written and designed and features the most comprehensive collection of photographs of western Odonata to date. With it's guidance I may yet be able to figure out those western Argia! As someone who's main occupation is thinking about dragonfly field guides, it still amazes me how far they have come. I can recall a time when the only field guides available were Virginia Brown's Cape Cod and Sid Dunkle's Florida books. Then there was a little booklet from Algonquin Park, a stapled color guide to Wisconsin, and then Dunkle's extraordinary "Dragonflies Through Binoculars." Now amid the disheveled stacks in my studio there are guides to Hawaiian damselflies, Alberta damselflies, Indiana, Ohio, British Columbia and the Yukon, Northeast Ohio, California, the Southwest, the North Woods, Massachusetts, California again, Texas, Alaska, a great Beginner's Guide. What have I forgotten? Had Bob DuBois and Mike Reese published "Damselflies of the North Woods" a few years earlier I needn't have bothered doing my damselfly book. I ordered three other guides this winter. The second edition of "Dragonflies and Damselflies of Northeast Ohio" by Larry Rosche, Judy Semroc, Linda Gilbert and Jennifer Brumfield, is quite different from the first. It is now mainly a photographic guide. Although I am a big advocate of illustration, it is a vastly improved book and the large, beautifully reproduced photographs are a visual treat. However I do think they missed an opportunity to use Jennifer Brumfield's lovely illustrations to greater advantage. I have to stick up for illustration. Their consistent orientation allows for easier comparisons between species but with only the species' names present on the plates the section feels like an illustrated index and a bit of an afterthought. The "Field Guide to the Dragonflies and Damselflies of Algonquin Provincial Park and the Surrounding Area" by Colin Jones, Andrea Kingsley, Peter Burke and Matt Holder is a book that does feature drawings and paintings. It reminds me of the Richard Lewington illustrated odonate guides to Europe and Great Britain, two of the most beautiful dragonfly guides ever produced. I particularly love the Gomphid plates. Well-organized and wonderfully insightful, I'll try not to be too obvious if when I steal something from it for my own book. Published in 2007, "Dragonflies and Damselflies of Georgia and the Southeast" by Giff Beaton is not brand new but I had to replace my copy after it got ruined in yet another flood in my basement last year. Now indispensable, the Southeast needed a guide like this. It is very well written, and Giff's photographs are uncommonly good and show what they need to show. Four pages of Powdered Dancer (Argia moesta) variations = great stuff. Got room for more? Allen Barlow's New Jersey book and a guide to Arizona and Sonora by Doug Danforth and Rich Bailowitz are due out this year. And what about that Donnelly fellow? And Ken Tennessen's larvae book? A lot to look forward to! Best wishes, Ed Lam ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Dennis Paulson's and other recent books From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Sat, 2 May 2009 13:22:41 -0700 Ed Lam, who has so much praise for other books, gave us only hints of his own books. Anyone who has his Damselflies of the Northeast knows what a superb book Ed can put together, with beautiful and accurate paintings and drawings and informative text. Now he is working on a field guide to the Anisoptera of North America north of Mexico, and that is surely to be one of the most significant books to savor for the future. Be sure to visit his website http://homepage.mac.com/ edlam/ to travel with him as he gathers material for his book. Don't forget to check out his other works while you are there, for example http://homepage.mac.com/edlam/Illustration/44.html. Dennis Paulson On Apr 22, 2009, at 8:03 PM, azurebluet wrote: > Hi Marion and all, > > I also received my copy of "Dragonflies and Damselflies of the > West" yesterday and I wish to congratulate Dennis Paulson for > putting together such a feast of a book. I couldn't wait until the > kids were in bed so I could finally sit down and have a closer > look. It is well written and designed and features the most > comprehensive collection of photographs of western Odonata to date. > With it's guidance I may yet be able to figure out those western > Argia! > > As someone who's main occupation is thinking about dragonfly field > guides, it still amazes me how far they have come. I can recall a > time when the only field guides available were Virginia Brown's > Cape Cod and Sid Dunkle's Florida books. Then there was a little > booklet from Algonquin Park, a stapled color guide to Wisconsin, > and then Dunkle's extraordinary "Dragonflies Through Binoculars." > Now amid the disheveled stacks in my studio there are guides to > Hawaiian damselflies, Alberta damselflies, Indiana, Ohio, British > Columbia and the Yukon, Northeast Ohio, California, the Southwest, > the North Woods, Massachusetts, California again, Texas, Alaska, a > great Beginner's Guide. What have I forgotten? Had Bob DuBois and > Mike Reese published "Damselflies of the North Woods" a few years > earlier I needn't have bothered doing my damselfly book. > > I ordered three other guides this winter. The second edition of > "Dragonflies and Damselflies of Northeast Ohio" by Larry Rosche, > Judy Semroc, Linda Gilbert and Jennifer Brumfield, is quite > different from the first. It is now mainly a photographic guide. > Although I am a big advocate of illustration, it is a vastly > improved book and the large, beautifully reproduced photographs are > a visual treat. However I do think they missed an opportunity to > use Jennifer Brumfield's lovely illustrations to greater advantage. > I have to stick up for illustration. Their consistent orientation > allows for easier comparisons between species but with only the > species' names present on the plates the section feels like an > illustrated index and a bit of an afterthought. > > The "Field Guide to the Dragonflies and Damselflies of Algonquin > Provincial Park and the Surrounding Area" by Colin Jones, Andrea > Kingsley, Peter Burke and Matt Holder is a book that does feature > drawings and paintings. It reminds me of the Richard Lewington > illustrated odonate guides to Europe and Great Britain, two of the > most beautiful dragonfly guides ever produced. I particularly love > the Gomphid plates. Well-organized and wonderfully insightful, I'll > try not to be too obvious if when I steal something from it for my > own book. > > Published in 2007, "Dragonflies and Damselflies of Georgia and the > Southeast" by Giff Beaton is not brand new but I had to replace my > copy after it got ruined in yet another flood in my basement last > year. Now indispensable, the Southeast needed a guide like this. It > is very well written, and Giff's photographs are uncommonly good > and show what they need to show. Four pages of Powdered Dancer > (Argia moesta) variations = great stuff. > > Got room for more? Allen Barlow's New Jersey book and a guide to > Arizona and Sonora by Doug Danforth and Rich Bailowitz are due out > this year. And what about that Donnelly fellow? And Ken Tennessen's > larvae book? A lot to look forward to! > > Best wishes, > Ed Lam ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Tera Baird is out of the office. Please see message. From: Tera_Baird AT fws.gov Date: Fri, 24 Apr 2009 16:03:44 -0600 I will be out of the office starting 04/24/2009 and will not return until 08/03/2009. I wills be maternity leave starting 05/04/2009 - For the week of 04/27-05/01/2009, I will be in the office for 20 hours only & checking email. I begin full maternity leave on 05/02/2009 and I will return to the office on 08/03/2009 - Please contact Craig Aubrey if you need immediate assistance._______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Dennis Paulson's and other recent books From: "Marion Dobbs" <pond_damsel AT comcast.net> Date: Thu, 23 Apr 2009 18:11:04 -0400 Hi Ed and everyone, Lest anyone think I have anything at all against illustrations, nothing could be further from the truth. (The two career paths that beckoned me in my youth were architecture and medical illustration.) I even have warm, friendly feelings toward an illustrator or two :-). My comments in praise of the anatomical photographs in Dennis's new book were simply an expression of my excitement at having access to both types of visual aid. I need all the help I can get. In an ideal world - or field guide - I'd love to have everything illustrated and photographed! Ed, my two copies of your stupendous damselfly book are worn and tattered from use, and I am growing impatient for dragonflies! And, yes, Tennessen's larvae, oh when? Marion Dobbs ----- Original Message ----- From: azurebluet To: Marion Dobbs ; Odonata-l list Sent: Wednesday, April 22, 2009 11:03 PM Subject: Re: [Odonata-l] Dennis Paulson's and other recent books Hi Marion and all, I also received my copy of "Dragonflies and Damselflies of the West" yesterday and I wish to congratulate Dennis Paulson for putting together such a feast of a book. I couldn't wait until the kids were in bed so I could finally sit down and have a closer look. It is well written and designed and features the most comprehensive collection of photographs of western Odonata to date. With it's guidance I may yet be able to figure out those western Argia! As someone who's main occupation is thinking about dragonfly field guides, it still amazes me how far they have come. I can recall a time when the only field guides available were Virginia Brown's Cape Cod and Sid Dunkle's Florida books. Then there was a little booklet from Algonquin Park, a stapled color guide to Wisconsin, and then Dunkle's extraordinary "Dragonflies Through Binoculars." Now amid the disheveled stacks in my studio there are guides to Hawaiian damselflies, Alberta damselflies, Indiana, Ohio, British Columbia and the Yukon, Northeast Ohio, California, the Southwest, the North Woods, Massachusetts, California again, Texas, Alaska, a great Beginner's Guide. What have I forgotten? Had Bob DuBois and Mike Reese published "Damselflies of the North Woods" a few years earlier I needn't have bothered doing my damselfly book. I ordered three other guides this winter. The second edition of "Dragonflies and Damselflies of Northeast Ohio" by Larry Rosche, Judy Semroc, Linda Gilbert and Jennifer Brumfield, is quite different from the first. It is now mainly a photographic guide. Although I am a big advocate of illustration, it is a vastly improved book and the large, beautifully reproduced photographs are a visual treat. However I do think they missed an opportunity to use Jennifer Brumfield's lovely illustrations to greater advantage. I have to stick up for illustration. Their consistent orientation allows for easier comparisons between species but with only the species' names present on the plates the section feels like an illustrated index and a bit of an afterthought. The "Field Guide to the Dragonflies and Damselflies of Algonquin Provincial Park and the Surrounding Area" by Colin Jones, Andrea Kingsley, Peter Burke and Matt Holder is a book that does feature drawings and paintings. It reminds me of the Richard Lewington illustrated odonate guides to Europe and Great Britain, two of the most beautiful dragonfly guides ever produced. I particularly love the Gomphid plates. Well-organized and wonderfully insightful, I'll try not to be too obvious if when I steal something from it for my own book. Published in 2007, "Dragonflies and Damselflies of Georgia and the Southeast" by Giff Beaton is not brand new but I had to replace my copy after it got ruined in yet another flood in my basement last year. Now indispensable, the Southeast needed a guide like this. It is very well written, and Giff's photographs are uncommonly good and show what they need to show. Four pages of Powdered Dancer (Argia moesta) variations = great stuff. Got room for more? Allen Barlow's New Jersey book and a guide to Arizona and Sonora by Doug Danforth and Rich Bailowitz are due out this year. And what about that Donnelly fellow? And Ken Tennessen's larvae book? A lot to look forward to! Best wishes, Ed Lam On Apr 21, 2009, at 11:22:04 PM, "Marion Dobbs" wrote: From: "Marion Dobbs" Subject: [Odonata-l] Dennis Paulson's book Date: April 21, 2009 11:22:04 PM EDT To: "Odonata-l list" Amazon came through today with an earlier than promised delivery of Dennis's new "Dragonflies and Damselflies of the West." Hurry out and get one even if, like me, you don't live any further west than Georgia. So packed with information, my head is spinning. I especially like the plethora of comparison tables and diagrams that are such a nice supplement to the detailed text and great photographs. Maybe my favorite detail is the anatomicalphotographs. As good as diagrams can be, photos leave no doubt. Marion Dobbs 9 Bridlewood Lane Rome GA 30165 USA pond_damsel AT comcast.net http://www.mamomi.net http://mariondobbs.smugmug.com http://ponddamsel.phanfare.com _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Re: Dennis Paulson's and other recent books From: azurebluet <azurebluet AT aol.com> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2009 23:03:49 -0400 Hi Marion and all, I also received my copy of "Dragonflies and Damselflies of the West" yesterday and I wish to congratulate Dennis Paulson for putting together such a feast of a book. I couldn't wait until the kids were in bed so I could finally sit down and have a closer look. It is well written and designed and features the most comprehensive collection of photographs of western Odonata to date. With it's guidance I may yet be able to figure out those western Argia! As someone who's main occupation is thinking about dragonfly field guides, it still amazes me how far they have come. I can recall a time when the only field guides available were Virginia Brown's Cape Cod and Sid Dunkle's Florida books. Then there was a little booklet from Algonquin Park, a stapled color guide to Wisconsin, and then Dunkle's extraordinary "Dragonflies Through Binoculars."  Now amid the disheveled stacks in my studio there are guides to Hawaiian damselflies, Alberta damselflies, Indiana, Ohio, British Columbia and the Yukon, Northeast Ohio, California, the Southwest, the North Woods, Massachusetts, California again, Texas, Alaska, a great Beginner's Guide. What have I forgotten? Had Bob DuBois and Mike Reese published "Damselflies of the North Woods" a few years earlier I needn't have bothered doing my damselfly book.  I ordered three other guides this winter. The second edition of "Dragonflies and Damselflies of Northeast Ohio" by Larry Rosche, Judy Semroc, Linda Gilbert and Jennifer Brumfield, is quite different from the first. It is now mainly a photographic guide. Although I am a big advocate of illustration, it is a vastly improved book and the large, beautifully reproduced photographs are a visual treat. However I do think they missed an opportunity to use Jennifer Brumfield's lovely illustrations to greater advantage. I have to stick up for illustration. Their consistent orientation allows for easier comparisons between species but with only the species' names present on the plates the section feels like an illustrated index and a bit of an afterthought. The "Field Guide to the Dragonflies and Damselflies of Algonquin Provincial Park and the Surrounding Area" by Colin Jones, Andrea Kingsley, Peter Burke and Matt Holder is a book that does feature drawings and paintings. It reminds me of the Richard Lewington illustrated odonate guides to Europe and Great Britain, two of the most beautiful dragonfly guides ever produced. I particularly love the Gomphid plates. Well-organized and wonderfully insightful, I'll try not to be too obvious if  when I steal something from it for my own book. Published in 2007, "Dragonflies and Damselflies of Georgia and the Southeast" by Giff Beaton is not brand new but I had to replace my copy after it got ruined in yet another flood in my basement last year. Now indispensable, the Southeast needed a guide like this. It is very well written, and Giff's photographs are uncommonly good and show what they need to show. Four pages of Powdered Dancer (Argia moesta) variations = great stuff.  Got room for more? Allen Barlow's New Jersey book and a guide to Arizona and Sonora by Doug Danforth and Rich Bailowitz are due out this year. And what about that Donnelly fellow? And Ken Tennessen's larvae book? A lot to look forward to! Best wishes, Ed Lam On Apr 21, 2009, at 11:22:04 PM, "Marion Dobbs" wrote: From: "Marion Dobbs" Subject: [Odonata-l] Dennis Paulson's book Date: April 21, 2009 11:22:04 PM EDT To: "Odonata-l list" Amazon came through today with an earlier than promised delivery of Dennis's new "Dragonflies and Damselflies of the West." Hurry out and get one even if, like me, you don't live any further west than Georgia. So packed with information, my head is spinning. I especially like the plethora of comparison tables and diagrams that are such a nice supplement to the detailed text and great photographs. Maybe my favorite detail is the anatomicalphotographs. As good as diagrams can be, photos leave no doubt.   Marion Dobbs                                  9 Bridlewood Lane Rome  GA 30165 USA pond_damsel AT comcast.net http://www.mamomi.net http://mariondobbs.smugmug.com http://ponddamsel.phanfare.com _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Dennis Paulson's book From: "Marion Dobbs" <pond_damsel AT comcast.net> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2009 23:22:04 -0400 Amazon came through today with an earlier than promised delivery of Dennis's new "Dragonflies and Damselflies of the West." Hurry out and get one even if, like me, you don't live any further west than Georgia. So packed with information, my head is spinning. I especially like the plethora of comparison tables and diagrams that are such a nice supplement to the detailed text and great photographs. Maybe my favorite detail is the anatomical photographs. As good as diagrams can be, photos leave no doubt. Marion Dobbs 9 Bridlewood Lane Rome GA 30165 USA pond_damsel AT comcast.net http://www.mamomi.net http://mariondobbs.smugmug.com http://ponddamsel.phanfare.com _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: photos needed for field guide From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Sun, 19 Apr 2009 19:28:51 -0700 Hello, all. My Dragonflies and Damselflies of the West is about to be published by Princeton University Press, and I hope everyone who gets a copy will use it, learn from it, and enjoy it. I am receptive to constructive criticism and would very much like to know of any factual errors. I am hard at work taking and acquiring photos for the eastern field guide now. There are still quite a few that have eluded me so far, and I am listing them here. I would very much appreciate being able to use good photos of any of the following species and sexes. I have no photo budget, but those whose photos are used will get a copy of the book when it is published. I will need tiffs or high-quality jpegs with at least 1000 pixels on the long side of the cropped image. I submit them to the publisher at 300 dpi, but they can be at other resolutions, as long as the pixels are there. I'm also happy to use scanned images from slides or will accept slides, scan them, and return them right away. Hopefully this list can serve as a challenge to all those who will be in the field this summer. I will continue to acquire photos all through the summer, and hopefully this list can serve as a challenge to all those who will be in the field and may come across any of these (mostly uncommon) species. Thanks in advance! ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net ODONATE PHOTOS NEEDED BY DENNIS PAULSON FOR EASTERN NORTH AMERICA ODONATA FIELD GUIDE - April 2009 Western Red Damsel Amphiagrion abbreviatum F plains population Rainbow Bluet Enallagma antennatum F Little Bluet Enallagma minusculum F Vernal Bluet Enallagma vernale F Caribbean Yellowface Neoerythromma cultellatum F Azure Darner Aeshna septentrionalis F Amazon Darner Anax amazili M Regal Darner Coryphaeschna ingens F imm (grn eyes) Taper-tailed Darner Gomphaeschna antilope F Jade Clubtail Arigomphus submedianus F Banner Clubtail Gomphus apomyius M Gulf Coast Clubtail Gomphus modestus F Green-faced Clubtail Gomphus viridifrons F Acuminate Snaketail Ophiogomphus acuminatus MF Southern Snaketail Ophiogomphus australis M St. Croix Snaketail Ophiogomphus susbehcha MF Westfall's Snaketail Ophiogomphus westfalli MF Belle's Sanddragon Progomphus bellei F Riverine Clubtail Stylurus amnicola F Brimstone Clubtail Stylurus intricatus F Shining Clubtail Stylurus ivae F Yellow-sided Clubtail Stylurus potulentus MF Zebra Clubtail Stylurus scudderi F Townes's Clubtail Stylurus townesi MF Tiger Spiketail Cordulegaster erronea F Robust Baskettail Epitheca spinosa F Florida Baskettail Epitheca stella F Alabama Shadowdragon Neurocordulia alabamensis F Cinnamon Shadowdragon Neurocordulia virginiensis F Quebec Emerald Somatochlora brevicincta MF Calvert's Emerald Somatochlora calverti M Lake Emerald Somatochlora cingulata F Plains Emerald Somatochlora ensigera MF Fine-lined Emerald Somatochlora filosa M Coppery Emerald Somatochlora georgiana F Hine's Emerald Somatochlora hineana MF Hudsonian Emerald Somatochlora hudsonica F Texas Emerald Somatochlora margarita MF Ozark Emerald Somatochlora ozarkensis M Muskeg Emerald Somatochlora septentrionalis MF Purple Skimmer Libellula jesseana F Garnet Glider Tauriphila australis MF Sooty Saddlebags Tramea binotata F Antillean Saddlebags Tramea insularis F_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Joe Engler/MOBILE/R1/FWS/DOI is out of the office. From: Joe_Engler AT fws.gov Date: Sat, 18 Apr 2009 16:00:29 -0700 I will be out of the office starting 04/17/2009 and will not return until 04/27/2009. I will respond to your message when I return. _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Regional Field Checklists From: "Jim Johnson" <jt_johnson AT comcast.net> Date: Fri, 17 Apr 2009 18:29:09 -0700 Greetings Some of you may be interested to know that I've produced a series of regional PDF field checklists for parts of western North America. Each PDF includes two pages--one with the species grouped by family and scientific name, the second with the species ordered by English name. You can print the page of your choice or duplex both onto both sides of a sheet. Each checklist also indicates the occurrence of each species in each state (or Canadian province) within the scope of the checklist. The checklists which are currently available are found at http://odonata.bogfoot.net/fieldlists.htm . Let me know if you happen to find any errors or omissions. Cheers, Jim Johnson Vancouver, Washington jt_johnson AT comcast.net http://odonata.bogfoot.net/ _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Aquatic Insects Course From: "info AT srilankaninsects.net" <info@srilankaninsects.net> Date: Sat, 11 Apr 2009 06:00:27 -0400 I attended a course a couple of years ago taught by Fred (on Odonates in particular) and he was a great teacher, very inspiring in the field; the Humboldt Institute was a wonderful experience (great food, good accommodation, great fellow students) and I encourage anyone with a bit of interest to think seriously about attending this course. Nancy van der Poorten (nmgvdp AT netscape.net) Original Message: ----------------- From: odonata-l-request AT listhost.ups.edu Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2009 12:00:04 -0700 To: odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu Subject: Odonata-l Digest, Vol 63, Issue 5 Send Odonata-l mailing list submissions to odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to odonata-l-request AT listhost.ups.edu You can reach the person managing the list at odonata-l-owner AT listhost.ups.edu When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Odonata-l digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Aquatic Insect and Odonate workshop (Dennis Paulson) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2009 09:00:52 -0700 From: Dennis Paulson Subject: [Odonata-l] Aquatic Insect and Odonate workshop To: Odonata-l Message-ID: <2ED85E34-F028-4F2D-B41E-3585697CCA26 AT comcast.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ANNOUNCING ... May 31 - Jun 6 Aquatic Insects and Odonates of Coastal Maine Frederick H. SaintOurs, Jr. Descriptions of seminars may be found at http://www.eaglehill.us/programs/nhs/nhs-calendar.shtml Information on lodging options, meals, and costs may be found at http://www.eaglehill.us/programs/general/application-info.shtml There is an online application form at http://www.eaglehill.us/programs/general/application-web.shtml Syllabi are available for these and many other fine natural history training seminars on diverse topics. For more information, please contact the Humboldt Institute, PO Box 9, Steuben, ME 04680-0009. 207-546-2821. Fax 207-546-3042 E-mail - mailto:office AT eaglehill.us Online general information may be found at http://www.eaglehill.us -- Anne Favolise - Stanton, Assistant Editor Humboldt Field Research Institute and Eagle Hill Foundation PO Box 9, 59 Eagle Hill Road, Steuben, ME 04680-0009 United States Phone: 207-546-2821, FAX: 207-546-3042, http://www.eaglehill.us Publishers of three science journals. Northeastern Naturalist: www.eaglehill.us/nena Southeastern Naturalist: www.eaglehill.us/sena Journal of the North Atlantic: www.eaglehill.us/jona -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://mailweb.ups.edu/pipermail/odonata-l/attachments/20090410/ee541abe/att achment-0001.html ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l End of Odonata-l Digest, Vol 63, Issue 5 **************************************** -------------------------------------------------------------------- myhosting.com - Premium Microsoft® Windows® and Linux web and application hosting - http://link.myhosting.com/myhosting _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Aquatic Insect and Odonate workshop From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Fri, 10 Apr 2009 09:00:52 -0700 ANNOUNCING ... May 31 - Jun 6 Aquatic Insects and Odonates of Coastal Maine Frederick H. SaintOurs, Jr. Descriptions of seminars may be found at http://www.eaglehill.us/programs/nhs/nhs-calendar.shtml Information on lodging options, meals, and costs may be found at http://www.eaglehill.us/programs/general/application-info.shtml There is an online application form at http://www.eaglehill.us/programs/general/application-web.shtml Syllabi are available for these and many other fine natural history training seminars on diverse topics. For more information, please contact the Humboldt Institute, PO Box 9, Steuben, ME 04680-0009. 207-546-2821. Fax 207-546-3042 E-mail - mailto:office AT eaglehill.us Online general information may be found at http://www.eaglehill.us -- Anne Favolise - Stanton, Assistant Editor Humboldt Field Research Institute and Eagle Hill Foundation PO Box 9, 59 Eagle Hill Road, Steuben, ME 04680-0009 United States Phone: 207-546-2821, FAX: 207-546-3042, http://www.eaglehill.us Publishers of three science journals. Northeastern Naturalist: www.eaglehill.us/nena Southeastern Naturalist: www.eaglehill.us/sena Journal of the North Atlantic: www.eaglehill.us/jona _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: North American Odonata checklist available From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 08:55:33 -0700 Hello, all. Sid Dunkle and I have revised the checklist of North American Odonata that we first published in 1999. Jim Johnson has generously made it into a pdf for us, and John Abbott has made that available on Odonata Central. Thanks to all. http://www.odonatacentral.org/index.php/PageAction.get/name/ TaxonomicNotes You can view it on your computer screen or download it as a pdf file that can be printed. If anyone detects any sort of error in it, please let me know. And feel free to forward this to any local odonate listserve that I have missed. Dennis ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net Subject: North American Odonata checklist available From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 08:55:33 -0700 Hello, all. Sid Dunkle and I have revised the checklist of North American Odonata that we first published in 1999. Jim Johnson has generously made it into a pdf for us, and John Abbott has made that available on Odonata Central. Thanks to all. http://www.odonatacentral.org/index.php/PageAction.get/name/ TaxonomicNotes You can view it on your computer screen or download it as a pdf file that can be printed. If anyone detects any sort of error in it, please let me know. And feel free to forward this to any local odonate listserve that I have missed. Dennis ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: North American Odonata checklist available From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 08:55:33 -0700 Hello, all. Sid Dunkle and I have revised the checklist of North American Odonata that we first published in 1999. Jim Johnson has generously made it into a pdf for us, and John Abbott has made that available on Odonata Central. Thanks to all. http://www.odonatacentral.org/index.php/PageAction.get/name/ TaxonomicNotes You can view it on your computer screen or download it as a pdf file that can be printed. If anyone detects any sort of error in it, please let me know. And feel free to forward this to any local odonate listserve that I have missed. Dennis ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Subject: North American Odonata checklist available From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 08:55:33 -0700 Hello, all. Sid Dunkle and I have revised the checklist of North American Odonata that we first published in 1999. Jim Johnson has generously made it into a pdf for us, and John Abbott has made that available on Odonata Central. Thanks to all. http://www.odonatacentral.org/index.php/PageAction.get/name/ TaxonomicNotes You can view it on your computer screen or download it as a pdf file that can be printed. If anyone detects any sort of error in it, please let me know. And feel free to forward this to any local odonate listserve that I have missed. Dennis ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net Subject: North American Odonata checklist available From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 08:55:33 -0700 Hello, all. Sid Dunkle and I have revised the checklist of North American Odonata that we first published in 1999. Jim Johnson has generously made it into a pdf for us, and John Abbott has made that available on Odonata Central. Thanks to all. http://www.odonatacentral.org/index.php/PageAction.get/name/ TaxonomicNotes You can view it on your computer screen or download it as a pdf file that can be printed. If anyone detects any sort of error in it, please let me know. And feel free to forward this to any local odonate listserve that I have missed. Dennis ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net Subject: North American Odonata checklist available From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Tue, 7 Apr 2009 08:55:33 -0700 Hello, all. Sid Dunkle and I have revised the checklist of North American Odonata that we first published in 1999. Jim Johnson has generously made it into a pdf for us, and John Abbott has made that available on Odonata Central. Thanks to all. http://www.odonatacentral.org/index.php/PageAction.get/name/ TaxonomicNotes You can view it on your computer screen or download it as a pdf file that can be printed. If anyone detects any sort of error in it, please let me know. And feel free to forward this to any local odonate listserve that I have missed. Dennis ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net Subject: Fwd: DSA Annual Meeting From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Thu, 2 Apr 2009 16:26:16 -0700 I should add that Missouri will have lots of interesting dragonflies, as well as interesting dragonflyers. Begin forwarded message: > From: jcabbott AT mail.utexas.edu > Date: April 2, 2009 12:11:31 PM PDT > Subject: RE: DSA Annual Meeting > Reply-To: jcabbott AT mail.utexas.edu > > > If you haven't already registered for the DSA annual meeting in > Missouri, please do so. The organizers are trying to get a head > count of attendees. This should be a great meeting and I hope to > see most of you there. > > You can get information about the meeting and register at the > following url: http://tinyurl.com/5s7s6t > > John C. Abbott > President, Dragonfly Society of the Americas ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Tera Baird is out of the office for a conference From: Tera_Baird AT fws.gov Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 16:04:02 -0600 I will be out of the office starting 03/27/2009 and will not return until 03/30/2009. I will return to the office on 03/27/2009_______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Worldwide Dragonfly Association From: Dennis Paulson <dennispaulson AT comcast.net> Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 18:54:56 -0700 Dear Friends, As students of nature with an abiding interest in and enthusiasm about dragonflies, you have undoubtedly told yourselves many times how fortunate we all are to have these wonderful insects available to enrich our professional and personal lives. I am writing to you to ask you to consider sharing this joy with like-minded people by joining the Worldwide Dragonfly Association. The WDA is now in its 12th year and has grown over this time to be a vibrant and successful organization, always looking for new ways to encourage our science. Some of the advantages that membership offers are: Biennial International Symposia give the opportunity to meet with fellow students of the Odonata and discuss our common interests in a relaxed and friendly atmosphere. Our Symposia so far have been held in the USA, Sweden, Australia, Spain, and Namibia. This year the Symposium is in Mexico (details at http://www.odonatology2009.org/) and the 2011 Symposium will be in Japan. The Association’s operation is governed by a Constitution and By- Laws (see http://ecoevo.uvigo.es/WDA/dragonfly.htm) and a Biennial General Meeting is held during each International Symposium. At the BGM members are able to make their views known to the democratically elected Board and vote on issues brought up by the Board. The WDA publishes the INTERNATIONAL JOURNAL OF ODONATOLOGY twice a year on 1 April and 1 October. This journal has grown from strength to strength and is now in its 12th volume, with Volume 12 (2) appearing in October as a special issue dedicated to the memory of Philip Corbet. Recent numbers have featured numerous color photos. Among the many attractive features of IJO for the professional or amateur odonatologist are that the articles are wide-ranging, including: - faunistic studies, often of tropical regions that had been scarcely known; - descriptions of new genera and species, many more yet to come; - taxonomic studies elucidating how much we still have to learn about this very diverse and ancient group; - interactions between dragonflies and other insects, e.g., flies as odonate parasites and flies as odonate predators; - review articles about many features of odonate biology. Recent articles have contrasted fliers and perchers; noted the effects of global climate change on the group; synthesized what we know of larval life histories; discussed the evolution of openwing vs closedwing perching in damselflies; and, in a 430-page special issue, assessed the global conservation status of the order. Currently we have a very active committee exploring ways to improve the dissemination of work on Odonata, particularly ways in which we can incorporate electronic publishing into our journal. For more information please see http://ijo.tu-bs.de/home.html. The Association’ Newsletter AGRION is published twice a year on 1 January and 1 July and is freely available on the WDA website. It contains Association news along with articles of general interest on Odonata and is replete with full colour photographs. Please go to http://ecoevo.uvigo.es/WDA/dragonfly.htm to see AGRION. The International Dragonfly Fund (IDF), in cooperation with the WDA, publishes ODONATOLOGICAL ABSTRACTS in June and July. All issues, beginning with the July 2000 issue, are posted on the WDA's website in password-protected form and are available only to members. The Association provides grants for projects (including travel grants for young scientists to attend biennial Symposia) relating to (i) conservation of dragonflies or their habitats, and (ii) odonatological research. These grants are administered by WDA's Conservation and Fund Committee (CFC). Please go to the WDA’s website at http://ecoevo.uvigo.es/WDA/ dragonfly.htm for further information and for a membership application form. I hope that I shall soon have the opportunity of welcoming you to the Worldwide Dragonfly Association and seeing you at our meeting in Mexico. With very best regards, Gordon Pritchard President, WDA ----- Dennis Paulson 1724 NE 98 St. Seattle, WA 98115 206-528-1382 dennispaulson AT comcast.net _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Observado.org - to register sightings of your dragonflies all over the world From: Marcel Hospers <marcelhospers AT gmail.com> Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 23:53:31 +0100 *Observado.org - * *het registreren van waarnemingen van libellen in de hele wereld * Since a couple months Observado.org has been set up, the international alternative of the succesful Dutch website *Waarneming *.nland Belgium version *Waarnemingen*.be . The website * Observations*.be is the french version for Belgium. On *Observado*.orgyou can get a current overview of the bio-diversity (wealth of nature) of your holiday country or more information about the distribution of dragonflies and damselflies in the world. [image: Observado.org] On this website *Observado*.orgyou can enter your dragonflies sightings all over the world except Belgium and The Netherlands. It's use is free. You can add photo' sor sound recordings at your sightings. This is valuable if you hear birds, bats or grasshoppers. All sightings can be seen for free and it is also posible to see distribution maps. At this moment hundreds of sightings ay are already introduced by dozens of observers. The dutch website has almost 24.000 registered membersand in weekends over 10.000 sightings are added every day. This website contains all known dragonfly species of the world *Software for the smartphone and the PDA* This website also has an integrated software for the smartphone (WnSmart) and for the PDA (wnpda). A sighting consists of a species, a location and time. The time is taken from the PDA clock, the location from the GPS (built-in or with a bluetooth connection). More information about wnPDA can be found on this website.You can also download the software here . [image: Observado.org] *Dragonfly names* The dragonfly list contains near 6.000 species with their *Observado *.org in English, *Observado *.org in Deutsch, *Observado *.org in Dutch, or *Observado *.org in francaisname if available. This list is based on the World Odonata List, a checklist compiled by Martin Schorr, Martin Lindeboom and Dennis Paulson. *Photo's* The website contains a unique collection of photos. The photo's are screened by a team of experts this set of dragonflyphotos'swith their names and this makes this collection unique. *Forum* The site has a forum. If you have questions concerning European dragonflies you can create topic in the Dragonflies (odonata) of the World-forum. *Subsite's* It is also possible to make small subsites of *Observado*.org. E.g for Italy is a subsite available or for for dragonflies in Odonata in Italy. A good overview of possibilities of these subsites can be found in The Netherlands If you want more information about *Observado*.orgyou can send a message to info AT .... More information about Waarneming.nl can be found on Wikipedia._______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Northeast DSA Meeting - IMPORTANT UPDATE From: Bryan Pfeiffer <Bryan AT WingsEnvironmental.com> Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2009 15:53:38 -0500 Dear Odonatists: Now is the time to reserve your lodging for the Northeast meeting of the Dragonfly Society of the Americas, which will be based in Salem, New Hampshire, from July 31-August 2, 2009. We've settled on the Park View Inn: http://www.parkviewinn.com/ Although the motel would not set aside a block of rooms for us, it is the most reasonably priced lodging in the area and ideal for our field sites. SO RESERVE A ROOM NOW by calling 866-721-5139 and telling the desk that Shannon has approved the 10% discounted rate for our group. (Don't forget to ask for a non-smoking room if that's your preference.) The motel now has 48 rooms available for the nights we intend to stay. Rooms have wireless, refrigerators and microwave ovens. Here are our prices (including tax): Queen-sized bed - $62.10 King-sized bed - $71.99 Two beds for two people - $74.70 Even if you have not yet signed up to attend the Northeast meeting but suspect you'll be there RESERVE YOUR ROOM NOW. You can always cancel (24 hours before you're supposed to arrive). We are still working on other lodging and camping options. If you're looking for something more upscale, we have an $86.40 rate (for up to four people in a room) at the Sleep Inn in nearby Londonderry, NH (http://tinyurl.com/bhw7t2). Tell them that Keith has approved the rate for the DSA meeting. You must reserve these rooms by June 30. That's it for now. Details on the meeting and online registration are at: http://www.wingsenvironmental.com/nedsa/ Best, Bryan Pfeiffer and Pam Hunt Northeast DSA Meeting Coordinators -- Wings Environmental: www.wingsenvironmental.com Wings Photography: www.wingsphotography.com Vermont Bird Tours: www.vermontbirdtours.com _______________________________________________ Odonata-l mailing list Odonata-l AT listhost.ups.edu https://mailweb.ups.edu/mailman/listinfo/odonata-l Subject: Northeast DSA Meeting - IMPORTANT UPDATE From: Bryan Pfeiffer <Bryan AT WingsEnvironmental.com> Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2009 15:53:38 -0500 Dear Odonatists: Now is the time to reserve your lodging for the Northeast meeting of the Dragonfly Society of the Americas, which will be based in Salem, New Hampshire, from July 31-August 2, 2009. We've settled on the Park View Inn: http://www.parkviewinn.com/ Although the motel would not set aside a block of rooms for us, it is the most reasonably priced lodging in the area and ideal for our field sites. SO RESERVE A ROOM NOW by calling 866-721-5139 and telling the desk that Shannon has approved the 10% discounted rate for our group. (Don't forget to ask for a non-smoking room if that's your preference.) The motel now has 48 rooms available for the nights we intend to stay. Rooms have wireless, refrigerators and microwave ovens. Here are our prices (including tax): Queen-sized bed - $62.10 King-sized bed - $71.99 Two beds for two people - $74.70 Even if you have not yet signed up to attend the Northeast meeting but suspect you'll be there RESERVE YOUR ROOM NOW. You can always cancel (24 hours before you're supposed to arrive). We are still working on other lodging and camping options. If you're looking for something more upscale, we have an $86.40 rate (for up to four people in a room) at the Sleep Inn in nearby Londonderry, NH (http://tinyurl.com/bhw7t2). Tell them that Keith has approved the rate for the DSA meeting. You must reserve these rooms by June 30. That's it for now. Details on the meeting and online registration are at: http://www.wingsenvironmental.com/nedsa/ Best, Bryan Pfeiffer and Pam Hunt Northeast DSA Meeting Coordinators -- Wings Environmental: www.wingsenvironmental.com Wings Photography: www.wingsphotography.com Vermont Bird Tours: www.vermontbirdtours.com